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Welcome to the hair of the dog podcast.

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I'm your host,

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Nicole Begley.

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And, oh my goodness.

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If I got a treat for you today,

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I have the queen of money mindset.

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The one,

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the only Denise Duffield Thomas joining me on the podcast today

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and we're breaking it all down from pet photographers,

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reluctance to charge all the way to my childhood shoes.

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So stay tuned.

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Welcome to the hair of the dog podcast.

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If you're a pet photographer,

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ready to make more money and start living a life by

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your design,

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you've come to the right place.

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And now your host,

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pet photographer,

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travel addict,

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chocolate martini connoisseur,

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Nicole Begley.

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Hey everybody.

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Welcome back to the hair of the dog podcast with me

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today, we have a very,

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very special guest,

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someone that I've been listening to in my ears for years

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and has made quite an impact on my life.

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Denise Duffield Thomas from Denise D t.com.

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Welcome to the hair of the dog podcast.

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Well, I am super honored because I'm obsessed with my dogs.

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It's good that I can combine my love of money mindset

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and my love of my dogs in one interview.

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That is awesome.

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Yes. Anytime we can combine dogs and anything,

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life is good.

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I was at the hair salon today and someone brought their

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dog in and it was just instant happiness for everybody in

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there. Yes,

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absolutely. So,

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yeah. So as you know,

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I have a big community of pet photographers and we love

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to chat about money mindset here on the hair of the

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dog podcast,

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because I believe success is so much more than just figuring

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out what your pricing is because,

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you know,

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if you do all the numbers and you get your pricing

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ready, but you still have this like energetic,

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just yucky feeling around your money or what you're charging.

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I feel like it's just really,

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really hard to get any clients because of that.

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Just yuckiness that you have.

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Absolutely. Absolutely.

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And it's every industry for sure.

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But what I find is the reason why I love coming

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on industry specific podcasts is because people try and tell me

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that they're the exempt,

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like the exception.

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They don't have to do money mindset work because they're like,

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no, but our blocks are real Denise justified loud to undercharge.

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And I hear this from every industry.

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So it's my favorite thing.

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I love it.

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Yeah. That's definitely gotta be quite the,

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quite the perspective you get talking to the hairdressers and the,

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you know,

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we are trying to say,

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and you're just on,

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Yes, we can't charge for it.

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Wedding professionals.

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Oh, I love it.

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So I can't charge for it.

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And photographers are really interesting,

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right? Because photography is one of those things.

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That's our record of our human lives.

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It's been around such a long time and yet we still

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discounted. And then you go into the different niches where,

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you know,

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oh, well I'm a,

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I'm a family photographer.

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So I can't charge.

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I'm a baby photographer.

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So why can't charge?

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I'm a maternity for,

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I can't charge pet photographers.

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I used to be hero too.

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I don't know you are,

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you are exempt from money,

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mindset work,

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but not,

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I mean,

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let's face it.

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Pet photography is one of those things we think,

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oh, it's so new.

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The earliest photographers took pictures of their pets to Right.

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That's what I always like to say too.

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If you look at art and you go to a museum,

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there's a lot of pictures of animals.

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I mean,

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the Egyptians,

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they were obsessed with their cats.

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Right. Right.

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You know,

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there are old,

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you know,

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books and records where people talk about their cats and you

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know, we're just,

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we're obsessed with our animals and that's always going to be

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the case.

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So why do we think that that's not a valuable thing

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to offer people even more so you can be married to

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someone for 70 years,

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but your pet only lives for a short period of time.

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I'd rather I'd way rather have more pictures of my pets

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than wedding pictures.

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Yeah. It's funny story.

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Whenever my husband and I travel,

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we end up sending more pictures of the animals to each

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other than we do of the kids.

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I, yes,

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same. My,

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my mom was babysitting and I was like,

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how are my babies?

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And she knew I meant the dogs.

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Oh yeah.

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And the kids too.

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Yes. But also the doctor,

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But that,

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that heartwarming video and it's like in a classroom and there's

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a box and the teacher says,

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go and look inside the box.

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There's a picture of my favorite student.

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And it's like this beautiful heart will mean music.

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And each student goes and looks in the box and then

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they kind of laugh.

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And at the end it's revealed that it's a mirror and

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Yeah, I'm going to do the same to my family,

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but I'm just going to put a picture of my dog

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in there and say,

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now look,

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you know,

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like go and have a look at my favorite member of

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the family.

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And it will be one of the features,

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one of my hobbies.

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That's like,

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that's my favorite child.

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And they'll go and look and go,

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oh, oh,

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Oh, I love it.

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I love it.

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Yeah. So I feel like as a photographer,

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people definitely have that mindset issue.

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And then it becomes a,

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it turns into a guilt of,

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I want everybody to have what I can do and you

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know, because everyone loves their dog,

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but this is a luxury,

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you know,

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most pet photographers,

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several thousand dollars for a session.

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So it becomes this luxury thing that then I think there

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becomes a guilt component to not being able to give it

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to everybody.

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Of course.

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And trust me,

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I hear this so often,

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you know,

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one of the case studies in my new book is someone

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who is a pelvic floor,

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yoga teacher,

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helping people with,

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with horrible postpartum issues.

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And she said the same thing I want.

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I'm so passionate about this.

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I want everybody to have access to this kind of work.

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And again,

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I hear this from so many different industries too,

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but here's the thing when you're undercharging and you're burning yourself

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out, you have zero overflow or you just,

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I'm sure you see people leave the industry all the time

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because they're burnt out.

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And when you are charging,

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win-win pricing to the majority of your clients appropriately,

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you have bend with them to come up with ideas where

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you can serve a lot more people.

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So in some industries that is writing a book,

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so then people who can't work with you one-on-one can,

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you know,

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you can still get your wisdom or it could be being

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very generous with your free knowledge and information of,

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you know,

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here are the tips of how to get,

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how to take your own photo shoots with your dogs.

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It's hard to have the bandwidth to do that when you're

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burning yourself out with one-on-one clients,

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or it means you can be really generous and give scholarships

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every now and again,

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or you can deliberately then do things like,

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you know,

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whole day ones where people can get one or two snaps

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with their dogs.

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But when your default is undercharging,

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when your default is over-delivering,

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your impact actually becomes smaller and smaller because we only have

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so many hours in the day when,

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when you're taking care of and you're charging win-win cause again,

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there's always people who will pay premium for anything.

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Then you have so much bandwidth to give back,

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but without being resentful over it,

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because it's not your default,

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Right? That's a,

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that's a great point for sure.

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Absolutely. And something,

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I think a lot of people in the industry struggle with

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because they are so much of empath and they live lit

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lead with their heart.

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And you know,

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we just want to photograph all the puppies.

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Of course,

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I think this is the big thing that I,

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I really have to work within.

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So many different industries is you can either work really hard

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and kind of hate your job,

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or you can love what you do and you're allowed to

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make money and love what you do you relate to.

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But I think it just breaks that feeling of no,

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that work is hard.

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Work is something you have to do that you don't like.

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And especially if you've left a corporate job to follow your

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dream of being a pet photographer or any kind of photographer,

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it feels like,

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then that's the sacrifice you're making of going.

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Wow. One path leads to money and one path,

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you know what I've decided I'm going to be some sort

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of artist.

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So therefore I have to be a starving artist.

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Therefore I have to choose this path of undercharging overdelivering and

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being broke.

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And it feels like if you converge those paths,

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then you're a sell out or you don't care doing something

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somehow unethical.

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And again,

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I hear this in so many different industries,

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but we have to go and do our own inner work

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around that.

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What is worthy of charging for what is real work?

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Am I allowed to have so much fun and still make

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a great profit and make a great living?

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I love that.

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And you know,

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there's so much talk about finding your purpose.

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And I think just society in general,

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over many,

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many years just like beats it into.

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If you go to school,

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you get a job,

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you do it for 40 years,

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then you retire.

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Then you can have fun.

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And you know,

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our purpose I think,

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is always tied to interest and always tied to following our

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passion, always tied to follow in our joy.

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And if that's what we're here on earth to do,

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then yes,

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we are going to have fun to do that.

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And yeah,

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you're exactly right.

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That why,

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who said,

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who made up the rule that said,

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do you can't have fun or enjoy your work?

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Well, you know what,

275
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there's a couple of things around that,

276
00:09:56,250 --> 00:09:59,040
right? One is that if you think back to your own

277
00:09:59,040 --> 00:10:00,000
experiences of,

278
00:10:00,120 --> 00:10:04,470
of work and your work is most of us grew up

279
00:10:04,470 --> 00:10:07,020
watching that on TV or it was just in our own

280
00:10:07,020 --> 00:10:07,860
families. Right.

281
00:10:08,100 --> 00:10:12,510
And so often our own family's professions has a really big,

282
00:10:13,530 --> 00:10:16,830
like impact on how we feel about work.

283
00:10:17,310 --> 00:10:20,040
What was considered real work in your family.

284
00:10:20,400 --> 00:10:23,190
Also, what did you see on TV about creative people?

285
00:10:23,190 --> 00:10:24,180
About entrepreneurs?

286
00:10:24,600 --> 00:10:25,590
One for me,

287
00:10:25,590 --> 00:10:25,920
I never,

288
00:10:26,430 --> 00:10:29,550
I didn't really see a lot of female entrepreneurs.

289
00:10:29,790 --> 00:10:33,300
Right. I didn't see a lot of creatives like writers and

290
00:10:33,330 --> 00:10:36,660
often then they was sort of shown as being a bit

291
00:10:37,230 --> 00:10:40,110
ditsy or bad with money or again,

292
00:10:40,110 --> 00:10:41,430
that nurture personality.

293
00:10:41,460 --> 00:10:41,820
Oh, I'm,

294
00:10:41,910 --> 00:10:42,600
I'm doing it,

295
00:10:42,600 --> 00:10:44,070
but I'm not making any money out of it.

296
00:10:44,700 --> 00:10:47,010
And, or the other side of it,

297
00:10:47,100 --> 00:10:48,330
rich bitches,

298
00:10:49,680 --> 00:10:49,950
you know?

299
00:10:49,950 --> 00:10:52,680
And so when would you ever even seen,

300
00:10:53,250 --> 00:10:54,600
like, what was your impression?

301
00:10:54,600 --> 00:10:55,470
I'm put it back on you,

302
00:10:55,470 --> 00:10:56,550
Nicole, growing up.

303
00:10:56,580 --> 00:10:59,160
What, what did you see who were photographers,

304
00:10:59,160 --> 00:11:00,840
who were allowed to be photographers?

305
00:11:01,950 --> 00:11:02,460
I mean,

306
00:11:02,790 --> 00:11:03,630
back growing up,

307
00:11:03,630 --> 00:11:04,440
it was,

308
00:11:04,560 --> 00:11:06,150
the industry has changed so much.

309
00:11:06,150 --> 00:11:10,950
It was definitely old men in a studio doing like the

310
00:11:10,950 --> 00:11:12,000
Olin mills,

311
00:11:12,030 --> 00:11:13,410
like Sears,

312
00:11:13,470 --> 00:11:16,440
like, like little portrait.

313
00:11:16,590 --> 00:11:20,250
There was definitely no animals involved and it was just all

314
00:11:20,250 --> 00:11:21,570
very cut and dry.

315
00:11:21,570 --> 00:11:22,770
And this is how it is.

316
00:11:22,890 --> 00:11:25,020
But then just the general work.

317
00:11:25,950 --> 00:11:28,260
I, my parents were both,

318
00:11:28,290 --> 00:11:30,180
both had an entrepreneurial family,

319
00:11:30,180 --> 00:11:30,900
my grandparents.

320
00:11:30,900 --> 00:11:32,970
So then my parents both worked in those businesses.

321
00:11:33,720 --> 00:11:35,670
So I felt like I had at least a little bit

322
00:11:35,670 --> 00:11:37,260
of a heads up or a little bit of a,

323
00:11:37,260 --> 00:11:38,430
like a leg up of,

324
00:11:38,430 --> 00:11:40,380
Hey, you can actually work for yourself.

325
00:11:41,010 --> 00:11:43,650
But I still saw them both working very hard.

326
00:11:43,860 --> 00:11:45,090
And you know,

327
00:11:45,090 --> 00:11:47,010
there was a lot of money stories too,

328
00:11:47,010 --> 00:11:49,410
about one of my big ones was easy,

329
00:11:49,410 --> 00:11:52,710
come easy go because of,

330
00:11:53,140 --> 00:11:53,380
you know,

331
00:11:53,380 --> 00:11:55,600
my grandparents had a,

332
00:11:55,850 --> 00:11:57,460
a trucking business that,

333
00:11:57,520 --> 00:11:57,850
you know,

334
00:11:57,880 --> 00:12:00,010
eventually when it away.

335
00:12:00,010 --> 00:12:02,620
And then my dad was working in the mortgage industry in

336
00:12:02,620 --> 00:12:05,260
oh eight when that whole entire industry imploded.

337
00:12:05,590 --> 00:12:06,910
So there was a lot of,

338
00:12:07,390 --> 00:12:07,840
a lot of,

339
00:12:07,870 --> 00:12:11,230
oh, although you can't control anything and something bad can happen

340
00:12:11,230 --> 00:12:11,920
at any time.

341
00:12:12,430 --> 00:12:14,110
Yeah, absolutely.

342
00:12:14,500 --> 00:12:19,180
And I would say even to the people who are growing

343
00:12:19,180 --> 00:12:19,900
up now,

344
00:12:19,930 --> 00:12:22,120
they're seeing different forms of work.

345
00:12:22,130 --> 00:12:23,800
Right. But we,

346
00:12:23,800 --> 00:12:24,130
I mean,

347
00:12:24,160 --> 00:12:26,020
I'm just talking to myself here I'm 42,

348
00:12:26,020 --> 00:12:28,180
but I grew up in a world where like there wasn't

349
00:12:28,180 --> 00:12:28,930
the internet.

350
00:12:29,170 --> 00:12:32,140
And so there was no way for people to leverage any

351
00:12:32,140 --> 00:12:34,840
business beyond where they geographically lived.

352
00:12:34,840 --> 00:12:35,680
Right there.

353
00:12:35,680 --> 00:12:37,600
Just wasn't there just wasn't the tools.

354
00:12:37,600 --> 00:12:39,310
And so I think people kind of,

355
00:12:39,430 --> 00:12:42,970
of our generation we've lived in these two worlds and our

356
00:12:42,970 --> 00:12:47,020
brains just can't quite comprehend that it's allowed to be easy

357
00:12:47,020 --> 00:12:49,390
and leveraged because the tools just weren't available.

358
00:12:49,390 --> 00:12:54,340
It's like just breaks that like dollar for effort relationship.

359
00:12:55,570 --> 00:12:56,170
Yeah, absolutely.

360
00:12:56,170 --> 00:12:58,330
I remember going to college I'm 45.

361
00:12:58,390 --> 00:13:00,190
So I've just got just a couple of years on ya.

362
00:13:00,400 --> 00:13:01,450
But I remember going to college,

363
00:13:01,480 --> 00:13:02,260
my roommate was like,

364
00:13:02,260 --> 00:13:03,550
do you think we'll have email?

365
00:13:03,640 --> 00:13:05,260
I said what's email.

366
00:13:05,950 --> 00:13:07,510
Yeah. Yup.

367
00:13:07,810 --> 00:13:08,680
Yup. And yeah,

368
00:13:08,680 --> 00:13:09,430
we didn't even like,

369
00:13:09,430 --> 00:13:11,760
you didn't turn in written papers even in college.

370
00:13:11,800 --> 00:13:13,870
Cause not everyone had computers and crazy.

371
00:13:13,930 --> 00:13:14,860
Crazy. Exactly,

372
00:13:14,920 --> 00:13:18,070
exactly. And so then that's really formative time.

373
00:13:18,070 --> 00:13:18,700
Right. And then,

374
00:13:18,700 --> 00:13:19,900
so, you know,

375
00:13:19,900 --> 00:13:22,240
even like probably throughout our twenties as well,

376
00:13:22,240 --> 00:13:22,990
like it just,

377
00:13:23,260 --> 00:13:26,680
it just wasn't available to entrepreneurs to be able to do

378
00:13:26,680 --> 00:13:28,780
that. And so now to think,

379
00:13:29,020 --> 00:13:31,600
wow, I can not only photograph people,

380
00:13:31,750 --> 00:13:33,700
but I can license my work.

381
00:13:33,730 --> 00:13:34,330
I can,

382
00:13:34,450 --> 00:13:36,580
I have all these tools to make it easier for me

383
00:13:36,580 --> 00:13:37,300
to do the edits.

384
00:13:37,960 --> 00:13:38,800
So then it's,

385
00:13:38,860 --> 00:13:39,100
you know,

386
00:13:39,100 --> 00:13:41,860
it's easy for me to produce lots of work for them.

387
00:13:41,860 --> 00:13:43,240
It's not like you have to go,

388
00:13:43,300 --> 00:13:43,750
oh my God,

389
00:13:43,750 --> 00:13:44,350
it's, you know,

390
00:13:44,350 --> 00:13:47,500
I have to buy more film and I'm going to waste

391
00:13:47,500 --> 00:13:47,950
the shots.

392
00:13:48,220 --> 00:13:51,940
And so I think it just doesn't feel quite right as

393
00:13:51,940 --> 00:13:54,580
well as the fact that so many people still working jobs

394
00:13:54,580 --> 00:13:55,330
that they don't like.

395
00:13:55,330 --> 00:13:58,960
So it feels like this guilty luxury to be able to

396
00:13:58,960 --> 00:14:01,270
do something you love and get paid for it.

397
00:14:01,510 --> 00:14:03,400
So I think it just breaks our brains a little bit,

398
00:14:03,580 --> 00:14:04,150
to be honest.

399
00:14:04,150 --> 00:14:06,700
Yeah, Absolutely.

400
00:14:07,060 --> 00:14:09,700
Yeah. What are some of,

401
00:14:09,730 --> 00:14:10,060
you know,

402
00:14:10,060 --> 00:14:13,390
I think one of the hardest things of finding these different

403
00:14:13,390 --> 00:14:14,050
money mindsets,

404
00:14:14,050 --> 00:14:14,770
because you know,

405
00:14:15,670 --> 00:14:16,900
you talk about it all the time.

406
00:14:16,960 --> 00:14:18,550
You uncover one and then you're like,

407
00:14:18,580 --> 00:14:19,120
oh, all right.

408
00:14:19,120 --> 00:14:19,780
I got that one.

409
00:14:19,840 --> 00:14:21,700
Oh, well there's a new one.

410
00:14:21,880 --> 00:14:22,840
Whoa. Okay.

411
00:14:22,840 --> 00:14:24,250
There's a new one over here.

412
00:14:24,730 --> 00:14:27,490
So what are some of your tricks for just kind of

413
00:14:27,670 --> 00:14:29,980
seeing where we are and helping shot shine?

414
00:14:29,980 --> 00:14:32,890
The light on what some of our money stories are so

415
00:14:32,890 --> 00:14:34,330
that we can start to break them.

416
00:14:34,810 --> 00:14:35,350
Okay. Well,

417
00:14:35,350 --> 00:14:37,690
I've been asking everyone interviewing me.

418
00:14:37,690 --> 00:14:40,300
I've been asking them a question because it's really fun to

419
00:14:40,300 --> 00:14:40,990
tend the tickets.

420
00:14:41,890 --> 00:14:42,670
Tell me,

421
00:14:42,850 --> 00:14:45,430
tell me about your school shoes.

422
00:14:46,330 --> 00:14:47,470
Tell me what my school shoes.

423
00:14:47,820 --> 00:14:49,360
Tell me about your school shoes.

424
00:14:50,020 --> 00:14:50,770
Oh gosh.

425
00:14:51,290 --> 00:14:54,830
I honestly don't remember.

426
00:14:54,860 --> 00:14:55,790
They were just like,

427
00:14:56,090 --> 00:14:57,650
okay. Normal shoes,

428
00:14:58,070 --> 00:14:59,660
nothing special about them.

429
00:14:59,660 --> 00:15:01,670
Nothing bad about them.

430
00:15:01,910 --> 00:15:04,670
They were just your average shoe that I remember.

431
00:15:06,110 --> 00:15:07,520
What did your parents talk about?

432
00:15:07,520 --> 00:15:12,380
Like when it came to like buying things like school shoes?

433
00:15:12,770 --> 00:15:14,990
Well, I remember my grandma.

434
00:15:15,050 --> 00:15:19,250
I don't remember my parents really ever buying school shoes or

435
00:15:19,820 --> 00:15:20,900
I wasn't with them,

436
00:15:21,770 --> 00:15:25,340
but I remember my grandma would take us school shopping before

437
00:15:25,340 --> 00:15:28,220
school started each year and we'd go to,

438
00:15:28,340 --> 00:15:28,760
oh gosh,

439
00:15:28,760 --> 00:15:29,720
I forgot what it was called.

440
00:15:29,720 --> 00:15:30,410
But it was like,

441
00:15:30,770 --> 00:15:31,130
you know,

442
00:15:31,640 --> 00:15:33,230
department store back in the day,

443
00:15:33,230 --> 00:15:36,500
like a nice department store and she would buy us always

444
00:15:36,500 --> 00:15:37,130
an outfit.

445
00:15:37,670 --> 00:15:38,420
And so that's,

446
00:15:38,510 --> 00:15:41,090
that's my remembrance of gosh,

447
00:15:41,360 --> 00:15:44,630
school shopping for as long as,

448
00:15:44,660 --> 00:15:45,020
you know,

449
00:15:45,020 --> 00:15:47,480
at least elementary and middle school all through those years.

450
00:15:47,690 --> 00:15:49,550
And then when I was old enough for high school was

451
00:15:49,550 --> 00:15:50,720
here's some money to go shopping.

452
00:15:51,680 --> 00:15:56,480
Yeah. And the reason why I ask that is that sometimes,

453
00:15:57,770 --> 00:15:59,540
and I try and keep it pretty open just to say

454
00:15:59,540 --> 00:16:00,440
to them about school shoes,

455
00:16:00,770 --> 00:16:07,700
because for some people they immediately remember different things.

456
00:16:07,700 --> 00:16:09,080
So, so for some people they say,

457
00:16:09,110 --> 00:16:12,590
oh, well this kid had this and I had this.

458
00:16:13,160 --> 00:16:15,950
And so they start to remember the first time they remember

459
00:16:15,950 --> 00:16:19,700
contrast coming up about what they wanted.

460
00:16:19,970 --> 00:16:20,930
And so some people might say,

461
00:16:20,930 --> 00:16:23,990
well, I had the real geeky shoes or I really wanted

462
00:16:23,990 --> 00:16:25,880
the cool shoes or,

463
00:16:27,110 --> 00:16:29,330
or I remember what a stress it was for my family

464
00:16:29,330 --> 00:16:29,690
every year.

465
00:16:29,750 --> 00:16:31,700
I was only allowed one pair of school shoes a year,

466
00:16:32,150 --> 00:16:32,930
something like that.

467
00:16:33,110 --> 00:16:36,530
But it's really interesting to start to look at what some

468
00:16:36,530 --> 00:16:39,350
of those stories that come up for you when you were

469
00:16:39,350 --> 00:16:40,730
first aware of money.

470
00:16:41,060 --> 00:16:43,640
Yeah. Mine is definitely,

471
00:16:43,880 --> 00:16:44,930
instead of shoes,

472
00:16:44,960 --> 00:16:47,060
it was houses like that.

473
00:16:47,270 --> 00:16:52,280
I Remember Just going to other people's houses and always feeling

474
00:16:52,280 --> 00:16:53,390
like, oh,

475
00:16:53,810 --> 00:16:54,920
this house is really nice,

476
00:16:54,920 --> 00:16:56,120
but now looking back,

477
00:16:56,120 --> 00:16:56,360
I'm like,

478
00:16:56,390 --> 00:16:57,680
oh, that house was the same,

479
00:16:57,890 --> 00:17:00,200
same, whatever,

480
00:17:00,200 --> 00:17:00,530
you know,

481
00:17:00,530 --> 00:17:02,180
like probably prices our house,

482
00:17:02,180 --> 00:17:02,900
actually our house.

483
00:17:02,900 --> 00:17:04,250
Why did we even been a little bit nicer?

484
00:17:04,460 --> 00:17:05,690
But in my childhood brain,

485
00:17:05,690 --> 00:17:06,140
it was like,

486
00:17:06,170 --> 00:17:07,490
oh, this one's really nice.

487
00:17:07,490 --> 00:17:08,750
This one must be expensive.

488
00:17:08,780 --> 00:17:09,830
Oh, this is a fancy house.

489
00:17:09,860 --> 00:17:11,060
Oh, I wish I lived here.

490
00:17:12,050 --> 00:17:14,540
Interesting. And you know,

491
00:17:15,230 --> 00:17:17,300
I never had a childhood of lack.

492
00:17:17,310 --> 00:17:18,230
So it wasn't like,

493
00:17:18,230 --> 00:17:18,590
you know,

494
00:17:18,590 --> 00:17:19,850
like you can look back and be like,

495
00:17:19,880 --> 00:17:20,420
oh yeah,

496
00:17:20,420 --> 00:17:20,690
you know,

497
00:17:20,690 --> 00:17:22,400
we struggled to put food on the table or this or

498
00:17:22,400 --> 00:17:24,110
that. Like I had,

499
00:17:25,520 --> 00:17:26,810
we had all the things,

500
00:17:27,410 --> 00:17:27,770
you know,

501
00:17:27,770 --> 00:17:32,030
and I don't remember any strong stories for my parents of

502
00:17:32,030 --> 00:17:33,290
like, no,

503
00:17:33,290 --> 00:17:34,130
we can't have that.

504
00:17:34,130 --> 00:17:36,350
Or we can't do this or that other than they did

505
00:17:36,350 --> 00:17:36,830
work really,

506
00:17:36,830 --> 00:17:37,490
really hard.

507
00:17:37,670 --> 00:17:39,440
So I still have that like,

508
00:17:39,500 --> 00:17:40,760
oh God,

509
00:17:40,790 --> 00:17:41,810
I got to work hard.

510
00:17:42,050 --> 00:17:44,510
And it's hard for me to catch myself sometimes and be

511
00:17:44,510 --> 00:17:45,380
like, dude,

512
00:17:45,860 --> 00:17:47,750
we need to take a little break and it's okay to

513
00:17:47,750 --> 00:17:49,920
go sit on the back porch and read for 20 minutes.

514
00:17:50,670 --> 00:17:51,810
Yeah, totally,

515
00:17:51,810 --> 00:17:53,190
totally. But even,

516
00:17:53,790 --> 00:17:54,030
you know,

517
00:17:54,030 --> 00:17:56,520
you saying that about the houses and things,

518
00:17:57,270 --> 00:18:00,840
what's really interesting about the work that I do is it's

519
00:18:00,840 --> 00:18:01,830
not as simple as,

520
00:18:02,130 --> 00:18:03,000
oh, you grew up poor,

521
00:18:03,000 --> 00:18:04,950
you've got scarcity books.

522
00:18:05,040 --> 00:18:06,150
Oh, you grew up rich.

523
00:18:06,180 --> 00:18:06,440
You know,

524
00:18:06,480 --> 00:18:11,100
whatever. It's really interesting what our brains create,

525
00:18:11,100 --> 00:18:15,390
but also what stories families have around money because some people

526
00:18:15,660 --> 00:18:18,300
grew up like in a very middle class kind of way.

527
00:18:18,480 --> 00:18:20,640
But depending on how their parents talked about money,

528
00:18:20,640 --> 00:18:22,440
they felt like they were poor or they felt like they

529
00:18:22,440 --> 00:18:23,100
were rich.

530
00:18:24,750 --> 00:18:27,390
It could have been that their parents always talked about money

531
00:18:27,390 --> 00:18:29,910
in such a way that they felt like they were one,

532
00:18:30,230 --> 00:18:32,760
one week away from being kicked out on the street that

533
00:18:32,760 --> 00:18:35,280
then they found out later that they found that parents were

534
00:18:35,280 --> 00:18:36,450
actually really well off.

535
00:18:36,480 --> 00:18:39,420
That would just extremely frugal and fearful about money.

536
00:18:39,960 --> 00:18:41,640
Similarly, I've heard from people who grew up,

537
00:18:41,670 --> 00:18:44,400
like they didn't realize that their family didn't have a lot

538
00:18:44,400 --> 00:18:47,310
of money because just the way that their family kind of

539
00:18:47,310 --> 00:18:52,110
shielded them from money conversations or they were very optimistic themselves

540
00:18:52,140 --> 00:18:53,640
or everything's going to work out great.

541
00:18:53,670 --> 00:18:54,450
Easy come easy,

542
00:18:54,450 --> 00:18:55,530
go. Like you said.

543
00:18:55,950 --> 00:18:58,500
And so it's really fascinating to start looking at your own

544
00:18:58,500 --> 00:19:03,510
stories, your own memories around money and what that is showing

545
00:19:03,510 --> 00:19:04,410
up for you today.

546
00:19:04,410 --> 00:19:05,580
And I'll give you an example.

547
00:19:05,970 --> 00:19:07,860
You might've heard growing up,

548
00:19:08,220 --> 00:19:08,430
you know,

549
00:19:08,430 --> 00:19:10,440
it's impolite to talk about money,

550
00:19:11,310 --> 00:19:12,540
which is a really common thing.

551
00:19:12,540 --> 00:19:14,970
Right? It's you would even think that that's not even that

552
00:19:15,480 --> 00:19:17,310
like damaging or anything.

553
00:19:17,310 --> 00:19:18,990
It's just that it's impolite to talk about money.

554
00:19:19,320 --> 00:19:21,090
And they might've even said it in a really nice way

555
00:19:21,090 --> 00:19:21,510
of like,

556
00:19:21,630 --> 00:19:21,870
you know,

557
00:19:21,870 --> 00:19:23,550
you never asked someone how much they weigh.

558
00:19:23,550 --> 00:19:25,800
You never asked someone how much they are in,

559
00:19:25,800 --> 00:19:26,010
you know,

560
00:19:26,010 --> 00:19:27,780
it's just impolite conversation.

561
00:19:27,780 --> 00:19:29,460
We want to keep things nice and you know,

562
00:19:29,730 --> 00:19:33,780
even, but then that might've created a story in people where

563
00:19:34,200 --> 00:19:36,240
they don't want to set prices,

564
00:19:36,390 --> 00:19:37,500
display prices,

565
00:19:37,740 --> 00:19:43,080
tell clients how much things cost really like get really wishy-washy

566
00:19:43,110 --> 00:19:45,930
when it comes to client inquiries,

567
00:19:46,290 --> 00:19:48,960
hight, invoicing hate chasing up payments,

568
00:19:50,010 --> 00:19:55,020
hate doing upsells Because it's so impolite to talk about money.

569
00:19:55,740 --> 00:19:57,590
And it's just you,

570
00:19:57,630 --> 00:19:59,880
it could be just so invisible to you.

571
00:20:00,360 --> 00:20:02,310
It's not like it's on a family shield.

572
00:20:02,340 --> 00:20:03,450
It's not like people have been,

573
00:20:03,570 --> 00:20:04,050
you know,

574
00:20:04,080 --> 00:20:06,330
painted it on the wall in your family house,

575
00:20:06,720 --> 00:20:09,840
but it's still a rule regardless.

576
00:20:09,960 --> 00:20:15,030
You might have a family story of resilience and you know,

577
00:20:15,030 --> 00:20:17,700
we're independent and we're tough and we're hard working.

578
00:20:18,060 --> 00:20:20,280
And then when it comes to your business,

579
00:20:20,670 --> 00:20:23,460
you might really struggle to outsource,

580
00:20:23,610 --> 00:20:23,820
you know,

581
00:20:23,820 --> 00:20:25,680
you're doing everything yourself.

582
00:20:26,370 --> 00:20:29,370
You might really height things like the editing that you don't

583
00:20:29,370 --> 00:20:30,930
want to outsource it because you have to do it all

584
00:20:30,930 --> 00:20:32,070
yourself. You,

585
00:20:32,260 --> 00:20:33,720
you feel your time.

586
00:20:33,810 --> 00:20:35,520
You feel guilty taking time off,

587
00:20:35,520 --> 00:20:35,670
you know,

588
00:20:35,670 --> 00:20:36,660
it could be things like that.

589
00:20:37,170 --> 00:20:40,680
And so you have to look at the official and unofficial

590
00:20:40,680 --> 00:20:42,210
mottoes of your family.

591
00:20:43,110 --> 00:20:44,190
Mine was an,

592
00:20:44,190 --> 00:20:45,480
I, they used to say this to me all the time.

593
00:20:45,720 --> 00:20:47,560
It's, it's nice to important,

594
00:20:47,560 --> 00:20:49,000
but it's important to be nice.

595
00:20:50,140 --> 00:20:51,700
And I it's really lovely,

596
00:20:51,700 --> 00:20:52,600
but my grandmother,

597
00:20:52,600 --> 00:20:52,780
you know,

598
00:20:52,780 --> 00:20:54,820
she was a very kind of soft kind of woman.

599
00:20:55,120 --> 00:20:56,590
And so I actually thought,

600
00:20:56,680 --> 00:21:01,720
because I was quite outspoken that I was like,

601
00:21:01,750 --> 00:21:02,350
I'm just not,

602
00:21:02,350 --> 00:21:03,910
uplight nice person.

603
00:21:04,540 --> 00:21:05,050
And it's,

604
00:21:05,110 --> 00:21:05,350
you know,

605
00:21:05,350 --> 00:21:06,640
I'm kind of a bitch.

606
00:21:07,090 --> 00:21:07,990
And if,

607
00:21:08,380 --> 00:21:08,560
you know,

608
00:21:08,560 --> 00:21:11,080
I have to be like likable and I have to,

609
00:21:11,080 --> 00:21:11,380
you know,

610
00:21:11,380 --> 00:21:15,160
be always thinking about like how I'm coming off as being

611
00:21:15,160 --> 00:21:16,540
down to earth and things like that.

612
00:21:17,170 --> 00:21:18,940
And so all of those little stories,

613
00:21:19,360 --> 00:21:23,020
they don't have to be traumatic for you to get information

614
00:21:23,200 --> 00:21:23,860
out of them,

615
00:21:24,280 --> 00:21:28,060
but it could even be something I remember one person said,

616
00:21:28,090 --> 00:21:28,810
oh my God.

617
00:21:28,810 --> 00:21:31,240
I remember when I was like 16.

618
00:21:31,240 --> 00:21:32,650
I said to my dad,

619
00:21:32,650 --> 00:21:34,420
I wanted to be an artist.

620
00:21:34,420 --> 00:21:34,870
And he said,

621
00:21:35,170 --> 00:21:35,770
well, that's fine,

622
00:21:35,770 --> 00:21:37,270
but you'll never make a cent from it.

623
00:21:38,110 --> 00:21:38,860
And it's almost,

624
00:21:38,860 --> 00:21:41,140
then that became her Mo her motto.

625
00:21:41,440 --> 00:21:42,430
Right. Right.

626
00:21:43,000 --> 00:21:44,980
Exactly. Yeah.

627
00:21:45,010 --> 00:21:48,430
Like so many times like a teacher even said,

628
00:21:48,430 --> 00:21:50,080
well, I remember this actually for my,

629
00:21:50,500 --> 00:21:51,580
well, for me,

630
00:21:52,390 --> 00:21:53,410
I remember.

631
00:21:53,830 --> 00:21:54,340
And I still,

632
00:21:54,340 --> 00:21:55,840
like, I don't even remember what teacher this is,

633
00:21:55,840 --> 00:21:57,490
but I wanna like hunt them down and be like,

634
00:21:57,760 --> 00:22:00,580
look, there are fences on the side of highways.

635
00:22:00,580 --> 00:22:02,110
I remember saying at some point,

636
00:22:02,110 --> 00:22:04,960
like you're driving on the highway that there's fences along the

637
00:22:04,960 --> 00:22:07,150
side to keep like the deer and stuff from the road

638
00:22:07,150 --> 00:22:07,690
that there's,

639
00:22:07,710 --> 00:22:08,170
there's just,

640
00:22:08,230 --> 00:22:09,430
there's often fences.

641
00:22:09,460 --> 00:22:09,820
And they're like,

642
00:22:09,820 --> 00:22:10,480
no, no,

643
00:22:10,480 --> 00:22:10,990
there's not like,

644
00:22:10,990 --> 00:22:12,250
man. I was like second grade.

645
00:22:12,460 --> 00:22:12,700
They're like,

646
00:22:12,730 --> 00:22:14,830
no. And still to this day,

647
00:22:14,920 --> 00:22:16,000
I'm trying it on the highway.

648
00:22:16,000 --> 00:22:16,480
And I'm like,

649
00:22:17,410 --> 00:22:18,670
there's another freaking fence.

650
00:22:19,150 --> 00:22:20,440
Oh, that's hilarious.

651
00:22:20,590 --> 00:22:21,700
I didn't really get that.

652
00:22:21,700 --> 00:22:22,360
That's so funny.

653
00:22:22,360 --> 00:22:22,690
You're like,

654
00:22:25,480 --> 00:22:25,900
And it,

655
00:22:25,900 --> 00:22:26,620
when these kids,

656
00:22:26,620 --> 00:22:30,070
like you say something just like two kids and they just

657
00:22:30,070 --> 00:22:32,020
take it as gospel.

658
00:22:32,020 --> 00:22:32,230
I mean,

659
00:22:32,230 --> 00:22:33,130
I remember I,

660
00:22:33,160 --> 00:22:36,010
my previous career before I became a pet photographer was a

661
00:22:36,010 --> 00:22:37,270
zoological animal trainer.

662
00:22:37,630 --> 00:22:39,160
And my daughter,

663
00:22:39,160 --> 00:22:40,690
I think in kindergarten,

664
00:22:40,960 --> 00:22:41,410
went in,

665
00:22:41,420 --> 00:22:42,700
I forget what it was,

666
00:22:42,700 --> 00:22:45,250
but she said something that was just like that her teacher

667
00:22:45,250 --> 00:22:48,400
said that was just not accurate as far as like natural

668
00:22:48,400 --> 00:22:49,240
history of animals.

669
00:22:49,240 --> 00:22:49,660
So I'm like,

670
00:22:49,660 --> 00:22:51,790
no, those two animals are separate animals,

671
00:22:51,790 --> 00:22:52,570
whatever it was.

672
00:22:52,930 --> 00:22:53,440
But she's like,

673
00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:54,430
no, no.

674
00:22:54,430 --> 00:22:55,270
The teacher said,

675
00:22:55,330 --> 00:22:55,720
I'm like,

676
00:22:55,750 --> 00:22:59,440
oh, I know more than the teacher in this particular case,

677
00:23:00,370 --> 00:23:01,510
he just wanted to leave me.

678
00:23:01,660 --> 00:23:02,650
But it shows right.

679
00:23:02,650 --> 00:23:07,570
It's not just your upbringing as in your immediate family.

680
00:23:07,570 --> 00:23:09,310
It's, it's your friends,

681
00:23:09,370 --> 00:23:10,750
it's your teachers.

682
00:23:10,810 --> 00:23:12,460
It's society,

683
00:23:12,460 --> 00:23:13,450
it's TV.

684
00:23:13,450 --> 00:23:18,580
It's all of those things combined that create our own individual

685
00:23:18,580 --> 00:23:20,110
story about money.

686
00:23:20,110 --> 00:23:21,580
And it is very messy.

687
00:23:22,270 --> 00:23:26,440
And I always do the analogy of excavating excavating that work

688
00:23:26,770 --> 00:23:28,000
because that's,

689
00:23:28,240 --> 00:23:29,560
I'm probably not using the right word.

690
00:23:29,950 --> 00:23:30,370
The, you know,

691
00:23:30,540 --> 00:23:31,240
the Strada,

692
00:23:31,240 --> 00:23:32,380
is that the word where it's like,

693
00:23:32,380 --> 00:23:34,990
when you look at a slice of like a mountain or

694
00:23:34,990 --> 00:23:35,500
something like that,

695
00:23:38,080 --> 00:23:41,170
but that's sometimes that's built up over like centuries,

696
00:23:41,170 --> 00:23:45,260
right? So our money beliefs have been built up like a

697
00:23:45,260 --> 00:23:49,670
day at a time incident at a time repetition over time.

698
00:23:49,670 --> 00:23:52,430
And it can be very dense and hard for us to

699
00:23:52,430 --> 00:23:53,060
even see.

700
00:23:53,450 --> 00:23:55,670
And so the work that I do is like chipping away

701
00:23:55,670 --> 00:23:56,480
at some of those things.

702
00:23:56,480 --> 00:23:57,680
And sometimes you,

703
00:23:57,730 --> 00:23:59,330
you find this nugget and you go,

704
00:23:59,420 --> 00:24:00,080
oh my God,

705
00:24:00,080 --> 00:24:01,610
this is why I can't do the thing,

706
00:24:02,450 --> 00:24:03,350
the one thing.

707
00:24:03,350 --> 00:24:04,910
But then other times it's,

708
00:24:05,160 --> 00:24:07,940
it's just the layers on layers of it,

709
00:24:08,000 --> 00:24:10,820
of the repetition of even.

710
00:24:11,480 --> 00:24:11,780
And I,

711
00:24:11,790 --> 00:24:12,440
this is my job.

712
00:24:12,440 --> 00:24:14,180
Right. I love finding the nuances.

713
00:24:14,240 --> 00:24:15,500
Right. I love it.

714
00:24:15,500 --> 00:24:15,710
Love it,

715
00:24:15,710 --> 00:24:15,980
love it.

716
00:24:16,160 --> 00:24:18,080
So I started to go really top-line.

717
00:24:18,080 --> 00:24:21,110
So when I started interviewing different profession groups,

718
00:24:21,530 --> 00:24:22,940
because I wanted to hear the,

719
00:24:22,970 --> 00:24:24,440
the commonalities in,

720
00:24:24,440 --> 00:24:26,420
what were you taught even in your training,

721
00:24:26,990 --> 00:24:27,200
you know,

722
00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:30,020
and a lot of like people in the natural health world,

723
00:24:30,020 --> 00:24:30,440
for example,

724
00:24:30,440 --> 00:24:31,640
like people who had natural paths,

725
00:24:32,090 --> 00:24:33,650
they explicitly told in training,

726
00:24:33,680 --> 00:24:35,630
I hope you're not going into this to make money.

727
00:24:36,230 --> 00:24:36,800
Oh, wow.

728
00:24:37,280 --> 00:24:39,530
Yeah. Like he better be going to this for the right

729
00:24:39,530 --> 00:24:40,250
reason. Right.

730
00:24:40,910 --> 00:24:43,400
So I started bringing together those industry groups just to say,

731
00:24:43,400 --> 00:24:45,020
like, what's the flavor of your industry.

732
00:24:45,380 --> 00:24:49,280
I remember I hired someone to come and teach me ukulele

733
00:24:50,330 --> 00:24:50,660
to make,

734
00:24:50,690 --> 00:24:51,020
I thought,

735
00:24:51,020 --> 00:24:53,060
when this be a fun time to learn the PA the

736
00:24:53,060 --> 00:24:54,350
ukulele and the pandemic.

737
00:24:56,900 --> 00:25:00,170
Anyway, I started doing some zoom sessions because of the pandemic.

738
00:25:00,620 --> 00:25:01,310
And I,

739
00:25:01,610 --> 00:25:02,390
at the end of one of them,

740
00:25:02,390 --> 00:25:02,690
I said,

741
00:25:02,720 --> 00:25:03,080
oh, look,

742
00:25:03,080 --> 00:25:04,460
I hope I never do this,

743
00:25:04,460 --> 00:25:05,480
but I just wanted to say,

744
00:25:05,480 --> 00:25:07,610
I really think you could up your prices a little bit.

745
00:25:08,090 --> 00:25:08,360
I said,

746
00:25:08,360 --> 00:25:10,910
I think your prices are just like really low for,

747
00:25:10,910 --> 00:25:11,300
you know,

748
00:25:11,630 --> 00:25:12,020
and he said,

749
00:25:12,020 --> 00:25:14,210
well, there's one guy in town.

750
00:25:14,210 --> 00:25:18,020
And he like teaches all of us how to teach ukulele.

751
00:25:18,020 --> 00:25:19,580
And he kind of sets the prices.

752
00:25:21,110 --> 00:25:21,710
And so it's just,

753
00:25:21,710 --> 00:25:22,580
this made up thing.

754
00:25:22,580 --> 00:25:23,090
And I was like,

755
00:25:23,300 --> 00:25:26,360
this guy might have been in the industry for decades and

756
00:25:26,360 --> 00:25:28,250
decades. Maybe he's even paid off his house.

757
00:25:28,250 --> 00:25:28,820
And so for him,

758
00:25:28,820 --> 00:25:29,240
he's just like,

759
00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:30,660
well, this is just a fun way of making me.

760
00:25:31,340 --> 00:25:34,310
But yet all of his students are capping their prices on

761
00:25:34,310 --> 00:25:34,670
a price.

762
00:25:34,740 --> 00:25:36,260
He probably said 30 years ago,

763
00:25:36,680 --> 00:25:37,850
right? Yes.

764
00:25:38,000 --> 00:25:38,900
So there's those things.

765
00:25:38,900 --> 00:25:43,490
But then this is really fun to bring together country groups

766
00:25:43,520 --> 00:25:44,540
or cultural groups.

767
00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:49,970
So I pulled together some of my English clients and I

768
00:25:49,970 --> 00:25:50,300
was like,

769
00:25:50,330 --> 00:25:54,260
okay, let's talk about like the stereotypical English values,

770
00:25:54,260 --> 00:25:55,760
because of course they're in nuances.

771
00:25:55,760 --> 00:25:57,200
I'm not saying you're all the same.

772
00:25:57,350 --> 00:25:58,220
Right? You live,

773
00:25:58,460 --> 00:26:01,100
you live in a country that has this flavor.

774
00:26:01,400 --> 00:26:01,970
And so again,

775
00:26:01,970 --> 00:26:03,470
sometimes it's about the contrast,

776
00:26:03,470 --> 00:26:05,300
right? Of what you're told,

777
00:26:05,300 --> 00:26:06,620
you have to believe in how,

778
00:26:06,830 --> 00:26:08,090
how much you deviate from it.

779
00:26:08,450 --> 00:26:09,920
That's why we talk about the generalities.

780
00:26:10,550 --> 00:26:11,000
And I said,

781
00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:13,490
well, one of the British values that I think is a

782
00:26:13,700 --> 00:26:15,830
outsider is you guys love to cue.

783
00:26:16,610 --> 00:26:18,770
You like to stand in lines and you like to take

784
00:26:18,770 --> 00:26:19,280
your turn.

785
00:26:19,430 --> 00:26:19,820
So I was like,

786
00:26:19,850 --> 00:26:20,810
let's talk about this.

787
00:26:21,140 --> 00:26:23,810
How is this showing up for you in your business today?

788
00:26:23,810 --> 00:26:24,800
And so some of them are like,

789
00:26:25,160 --> 00:26:27,050
well, I can't succeed.

790
00:26:27,050 --> 00:26:31,580
Unless my brother succeeds first he's ahead of me in the

791
00:26:31,580 --> 00:26:34,250
queue. I can't make more than my mentors.

792
00:26:34,310 --> 00:26:35,660
I can't make more than my teachers.

793
00:26:35,660 --> 00:26:37,880
I can't make more than my friends who started in the

794
00:26:37,880 --> 00:26:39,140
industry year before me.

795
00:26:39,260 --> 00:26:40,370
I have to wait my turn.

796
00:26:40,940 --> 00:26:41,690
And then of course,

797
00:26:41,690 --> 00:26:44,160
if you have that waiting my turn mentality,

798
00:26:44,430 --> 00:26:46,380
you're not going to put yourself forward for things.

799
00:26:46,380 --> 00:26:48,060
You're going to wait for people to come to you and

800
00:26:48,060 --> 00:26:49,440
say your numbers up,

801
00:26:50,040 --> 00:26:51,570
Right. Please come to the counter.

802
00:26:52,050 --> 00:26:55,080
And so we can learn something for all of those things.

803
00:26:55,080 --> 00:26:57,030
And then if we looked at the UK and break it

804
00:26:57,030 --> 00:26:57,810
down into cities,

805
00:26:58,080 --> 00:27:00,600
sometimes cities have a particular culture.

806
00:27:01,230 --> 00:27:02,280
Sometimes they have,

807
00:27:02,700 --> 00:27:02,940
I mean,

808
00:27:02,940 --> 00:27:04,410
they have a motto often,

809
00:27:04,740 --> 00:27:05,700
but it's like,

810
00:27:05,700 --> 00:27:08,610
what's the story of the place you grew up in?

811
00:27:08,640 --> 00:27:12,360
Is it a story of resilience and hard work?

812
00:27:12,660 --> 00:27:16,350
Is it a story of feast or famine is a story

813
00:27:16,350 --> 00:27:19,590
of scarcity is a story of creativity and abundance.

814
00:27:19,590 --> 00:27:21,870
And we appreciate artists in This,

815
00:27:22,410 --> 00:27:23,100
In this environment.

816
00:27:23,310 --> 00:27:27,330
So all of those things become your Strat up.

817
00:27:27,360 --> 00:27:29,070
Someone's going to write,

818
00:27:29,970 --> 00:27:30,810
Right. At least,

819
00:27:30,810 --> 00:27:31,110
you know,

820
00:27:31,410 --> 00:27:32,520
I'm going to tell me Like,

821
00:27:33,130 --> 00:27:33,540
you're in,

822
00:27:33,570 --> 00:27:35,130
you live in North Carolina.

823
00:27:35,130 --> 00:27:35,550
I do.

824
00:27:35,550 --> 00:27:37,560
But I grew up in Pittsburgh.

825
00:27:37,560 --> 00:27:39,030
I grew up the story Of Pittsburgh.

826
00:27:39,030 --> 00:27:41,880
Is that well Interesting that you're saying this,

827
00:27:41,880 --> 00:27:43,440
it was a steel town,

828
00:27:43,440 --> 00:27:46,140
like from world war II on where it was like all

829
00:27:46,140 --> 00:27:49,440
the steel for like all of world war II was basically

830
00:27:49,440 --> 00:27:51,510
made in Pittsburgh and huge,

831
00:27:51,540 --> 00:27:51,720
you know,

832
00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:53,280
the Carnegies and free,

833
00:27:53,310 --> 00:27:55,050
like all the huge,

834
00:27:55,080 --> 00:27:57,420
like early century money was all created in Pittsburgh,

835
00:27:57,450 --> 00:27:58,860
out of the steel industry.

836
00:27:58,980 --> 00:28:01,800
And then it all went away in the late seventies,

837
00:28:01,800 --> 00:28:06,600
early eighties still is this like hard work,

838
00:28:06,600 --> 00:28:08,220
hard work up gone,

839
00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:10,590
which I'm like,

840
00:28:10,620 --> 00:28:11,580
oh, wow,

841
00:28:11,820 --> 00:28:14,670
that really mirrors my stories,

842
00:28:14,670 --> 00:28:15,540
which is crazy.

843
00:28:17,010 --> 00:28:20,580
Again, it might be on a shield at the town hall.

844
00:28:20,730 --> 00:28:22,050
Right. But it seemed better at,

845
00:28:22,050 --> 00:28:25,530
in the school system it's embedded in,

846
00:28:25,980 --> 00:28:26,190
you know,

847
00:28:26,230 --> 00:28:28,950
who gets rewarded for different things.

848
00:28:28,950 --> 00:28:30,090
It's embedded in,

849
00:28:30,540 --> 00:28:31,550
in so many different ways.

850
00:28:31,800 --> 00:28:32,730
The sporting team,

851
00:28:32,730 --> 00:28:32,970
you know,

852
00:28:33,060 --> 00:28:34,920
are you a city that goes for the roots for the

853
00:28:34,920 --> 00:28:38,310
underdog or you're a city that always wins?

854
00:28:38,490 --> 00:28:38,730
You know?

855
00:28:38,940 --> 00:28:39,150
I mean,

856
00:28:39,210 --> 00:28:40,350
I grew up,

857
00:28:41,160 --> 00:28:41,940
I grew up in Sydney,

858
00:28:41,940 --> 00:28:43,560
but I live in a,

859
00:28:44,130 --> 00:28:45,150
in a coal town.

860
00:28:45,480 --> 00:28:48,540
Yeah. And it used to be a steel town.

861
00:28:48,720 --> 00:28:50,400
Okay. So there's this real,

862
00:28:50,400 --> 00:28:57,060
like a gala Tarion working class mentality here where I remember

863
00:28:57,060 --> 00:29:01,320
there was like a guy who became a billionaire locally from,

864
00:29:01,580 --> 00:29:02,310
from coal mining.

865
00:29:02,310 --> 00:29:05,670
But he bought like this Lamborghini and people are like,

866
00:29:06,630 --> 00:29:12,210
because it's just not done in this town to really showcase

867
00:29:12,660 --> 00:29:13,740
wealth through things like that.

868
00:29:13,740 --> 00:29:15,390
People might have really nice houses,

869
00:29:15,390 --> 00:29:17,580
but everyone's at the beach everyone's wearing,

870
00:29:17,580 --> 00:29:18,000
you know,

871
00:29:18,270 --> 00:29:19,890
board shorts and flip flops.

872
00:29:19,980 --> 00:29:21,150
And you know,

873
00:29:21,150 --> 00:29:26,010
you don't really want to like have that ostentatious kind of

874
00:29:26,130 --> 00:29:27,090
display of wealth.

875
00:29:28,050 --> 00:29:30,570
And so I did the same with Australians.

876
00:29:30,630 --> 00:29:30,960
I was like,

877
00:29:30,960 --> 00:29:33,300
okay, let's talk about Australian values.

878
00:29:33,920 --> 00:29:38,610
It's all about mateship and being a Galatarian and you know,

879
00:29:38,940 --> 00:29:39,870
and so then how did,

880
00:29:39,990 --> 00:29:40,860
and which is all great.

881
00:29:40,890 --> 00:29:41,830
There's nothing wrong with that.

882
00:29:42,100 --> 00:29:42,820
But then it was like,

883
00:29:42,820 --> 00:29:44,170
well, what's the story around that?

884
00:29:44,170 --> 00:29:44,800
And for me,

885
00:29:44,800 --> 00:29:48,850
I remember thinking I can't charge Australians.

886
00:29:49,960 --> 00:29:53,110
So that's why I set my business up to be American

887
00:29:53,110 --> 00:29:53,500
because I was like,

888
00:29:53,530 --> 00:29:54,790
I can charge Americans,

889
00:29:56,560 --> 00:29:57,940
charge my mates,

890
00:29:58,630 --> 00:29:59,710
charge of Australians.

891
00:29:59,950 --> 00:30:03,610
And then I realized I was also including New Zealand in

892
00:30:04,120 --> 00:30:06,700
Australia. My circle of mateship just got bigger and bigger.

893
00:30:06,700 --> 00:30:08,080
And then I was like,

894
00:30:09,220 --> 00:30:10,870
well, I'm married to a British guy.

895
00:30:10,870 --> 00:30:11,620
I've lived in England.

896
00:30:11,620 --> 00:30:13,930
Like basically my cousins.

897
00:30:13,960 --> 00:30:14,470
And then I was like,

898
00:30:14,500 --> 00:30:16,300
Irish people are kind of Scottish people.

899
00:30:16,570 --> 00:30:19,480
And I was just in just expanding the group of people

900
00:30:19,480 --> 00:30:20,920
that I wasn't allowed to touch.

901
00:30:23,410 --> 00:30:25,150
And so that's something too,

902
00:30:25,150 --> 00:30:28,330
if you grew up in like a real fairness culture or,

903
00:30:29,140 --> 00:30:29,410
you know,

904
00:30:29,440 --> 00:30:30,250
then you might think,

905
00:30:30,250 --> 00:30:30,760
well, it's not,

906
00:30:30,970 --> 00:30:34,420
it's not fair to charge this particular type of person.

907
00:30:34,720 --> 00:30:35,860
And so in your injury,

908
00:30:35,890 --> 00:30:36,490
it might be well,

909
00:30:36,640 --> 00:30:39,280
ah, I can't charge the dog with three legs,

910
00:30:39,280 --> 00:30:40,090
full price.

911
00:30:40,180 --> 00:30:40,960
I have to play,

912
00:30:41,470 --> 00:30:42,160
come on.

913
00:30:42,160 --> 00:30:42,820
I can't do that.

914
00:30:43,060 --> 00:30:43,690
Or, oh,

915
00:30:43,690 --> 00:30:47,020
I can't judge single moms or I can't charge whatever.

916
00:30:47,230 --> 00:30:50,080
And that doesn't mean people are never allowed to discount and

917
00:30:50,080 --> 00:30:51,520
be generous for sure.

918
00:30:51,700 --> 00:30:55,660
It's just watch where those stories of fairness start to come

919
00:30:55,660 --> 00:30:57,490
in and to be your detriment.

920
00:30:58,180 --> 00:30:58,960
Here's another layer.

921
00:30:58,960 --> 00:30:59,710
Sorry, Nicole.

922
00:30:59,950 --> 00:31:05,440
I just get so excited About this Birth order Or whatever.

923
00:31:05,440 --> 00:31:07,480
Right? So I'm the oldest.

924
00:31:07,900 --> 00:31:10,180
I feel responsible for everyone and everything.

925
00:31:10,900 --> 00:31:12,970
Everything's my responsibility to sort out.

926
00:31:13,690 --> 00:31:14,680
And so I was like,

927
00:31:14,830 --> 00:31:16,480
I'll work with anyone on anything.

928
00:31:16,930 --> 00:31:17,680
Throw me a problem.

929
00:31:17,700 --> 00:31:18,700
Also look for you.

930
00:31:19,000 --> 00:31:19,570
No problem.

931
00:31:19,990 --> 00:31:21,880
Middle children can be,

932
00:31:21,940 --> 00:31:24,280
they can be the fairness ones of going.

933
00:31:24,280 --> 00:31:25,030
It's not fair,

934
00:31:25,300 --> 00:31:26,950
making sure that everyone's taken care of.

935
00:31:27,490 --> 00:31:30,010
And then I see sometimes babies of the family,

936
00:31:30,400 --> 00:31:31,480
they almost their,

937
00:31:31,890 --> 00:31:34,420
well, I can't charge no one's going to take me seriously

938
00:31:34,540 --> 00:31:36,760
because they're 30 years old and they still have to sit

939
00:31:36,760 --> 00:31:38,290
at the kid's table at Thanksgiving.

940
00:31:39,170 --> 00:31:41,700
Right, right.

941
00:31:43,220 --> 00:31:44,960
Again, I'm not people listening.

942
00:31:44,990 --> 00:31:45,890
No, that's not my experience.

943
00:31:46,130 --> 00:31:48,800
It's just looking at the stories.

944
00:31:48,920 --> 00:31:54,290
Right. And finding those little nuances for yourself to go hang

945
00:31:54,290 --> 00:31:57,980
on. Why do I feel like I can't charge people this

946
00:31:57,980 --> 00:31:59,360
so many reasons,

947
00:31:59,360 --> 00:31:59,990
your upbringing,

948
00:31:59,990 --> 00:32:00,740
what you throw on TV.

949
00:32:00,740 --> 00:32:01,220
As I said,

950
00:32:01,220 --> 00:32:02,960
you both thought what,

951
00:32:03,230 --> 00:32:03,710
you know,

952
00:32:03,860 --> 00:32:07,460
those unofficial mottoes that you're living by again and again.

953
00:32:07,790 --> 00:32:08,720
That's really interesting.

954
00:32:08,720 --> 00:32:11,390
It's interesting that you mentioned to the UK because a lot

955
00:32:11,390 --> 00:32:17,390
of my UK students are just convinced that no one in

956
00:32:17,390 --> 00:32:20,360
the UK will pay a thousand pounds for dog photography.

957
00:32:20,360 --> 00:32:23,270
That this is only an American thing that only Americans can

958
00:32:23,270 --> 00:32:27,140
sell dog photography that doesn't work in the UK and it's

959
00:32:28,440 --> 00:32:30,140
getting a new appreciation for it.

960
00:32:30,830 --> 00:32:32,360
Well, I know I hear this a lot too,

961
00:32:32,360 --> 00:32:36,290
right. Which is why so many of British people,

962
00:32:36,470 --> 00:32:38,960
they go and buy from Americans and they go and buy

963
00:32:39,140 --> 00:32:42,200
Australians because other English people are not offering things,

964
00:32:42,740 --> 00:32:46,670
right. That's why they fly to America and go to a

965
00:32:46,670 --> 00:32:50,180
conference and go to things because there's not,

966
00:32:50,360 --> 00:32:53,930
I actually met someone who is a coach in England for

967
00:32:53,930 --> 00:32:55,130
the dance industry.

968
00:32:55,820 --> 00:32:56,750
So similar to what you do,

969
00:32:56,750 --> 00:32:57,080
but for,

970
00:32:57,200 --> 00:32:58,100
for dance teachers.

971
00:32:58,460 --> 00:32:59,090
And she was saying,

972
00:32:59,090 --> 00:32:59,270
you know,

973
00:32:59,270 --> 00:33:00,470
there's like 80,000

974
00:33:00,470 --> 00:33:04,730
coaches in the UK and there's only three that specialize in

975
00:33:04,970 --> 00:33:05,840
the dance world.

976
00:33:06,350 --> 00:33:11,300
And so I see those things as massive opportunities because everyone

977
00:33:11,300 --> 00:33:12,350
is obsessed with their dogs.

978
00:33:12,350 --> 00:33:14,750
British people are obsessed with their dogs.

979
00:33:15,260 --> 00:33:18,560
They invented the whole dog show industry,

980
00:33:19,730 --> 00:33:21,560
right. They,

981
00:33:22,370 --> 00:33:22,820
oh God,

982
00:33:22,820 --> 00:33:23,990
go to a British art gallery.

983
00:33:23,990 --> 00:33:26,030
See how many pictures of dogs,

984
00:33:26,120 --> 00:33:27,440
paintings, and dogs there are.

985
00:33:27,560 --> 00:33:28,370
So that's,

986
00:33:28,790 --> 00:33:34,160
that's either inaccurate or a massive opportunity to be an early

987
00:33:34,160 --> 00:33:36,810
adopter and to set the pace of,

988
00:33:36,810 --> 00:33:37,760
of what that means.

989
00:33:38,360 --> 00:33:39,890
And I actually really like that,

990
00:33:40,010 --> 00:33:40,310
you know,

991
00:33:40,340 --> 00:33:40,970
in Australia,

992
00:33:41,000 --> 00:33:41,810
I often look at,

993
00:33:41,810 --> 00:33:43,010
see what's happening in America.

994
00:33:43,040 --> 00:33:44,840
Cause I know that will filter down to us in about

995
00:33:44,840 --> 00:33:45,440
three years,

996
00:33:46,070 --> 00:33:48,220
sometimes quicker now obviously,

997
00:33:48,710 --> 00:33:49,430
but you know,

998
00:33:49,430 --> 00:33:50,300
your British clients,

999
00:33:50,330 --> 00:33:52,190
anyone can have that opportunity to go,

1000
00:33:52,190 --> 00:33:53,450
well, I mean,

1001
00:33:53,480 --> 00:33:54,710
what's coming up and what's new.

1002
00:33:54,710 --> 00:33:57,080
You remember when people in the kid photography world,

1003
00:33:57,080 --> 00:33:59,240
when the cake smash thing,

1004
00:33:59,690 --> 00:34:01,010
right. Was really cool.

1005
00:34:01,130 --> 00:34:01,490
It's like,

1006
00:34:01,490 --> 00:34:02,060
well, what's the,

1007
00:34:02,150 --> 00:34:04,310
what's the next version for you and your dogs?

1008
00:34:04,370 --> 00:34:04,850
You know,

1009
00:34:05,480 --> 00:34:08,180
just why not create some cool stuff.

1010
00:34:08,210 --> 00:34:11,030
And so I shared this before we hit record,

1011
00:34:11,030 --> 00:34:16,160
but I had a family photo shoot recently because my mother-in-law

1012
00:34:16,190 --> 00:34:17,240
was here from England.

1013
00:34:17,660 --> 00:34:20,360
And so we try and capture photos because we don't see

1014
00:34:20,360 --> 00:34:21,290
each other very often.

1015
00:34:21,290 --> 00:34:24,230
So it's just such a precious thing to be able to

1016
00:34:24,230 --> 00:34:24,620
do that.

1017
00:34:25,100 --> 00:34:28,700
And the kids were playing up so much as they do.

1018
00:34:28,700 --> 00:34:29,510
Right. They're just like,

1019
00:34:29,540 --> 00:34:30,860
I don't want to be in the photo.

1020
00:34:30,860 --> 00:34:32,210
They're making silly faces.

1021
00:34:32,600 --> 00:34:33,320
So I just went,

1022
00:34:33,500 --> 00:34:35,060
oh, can we just go and take pictures of me and

1023
00:34:35,060 --> 00:34:35,720
my dogs?

1024
00:34:36,650 --> 00:34:40,370
And so I ended up with like 30 pictures of me

1025
00:34:40,700 --> 00:34:43,040
and my dogs and I'm so thrilled.

1026
00:34:43,640 --> 00:34:46,730
And I don't think I have a ton of pet photographers

1027
00:34:47,000 --> 00:34:47,480
in my,

1028
00:34:47,510 --> 00:34:48,260
in my town.

1029
00:34:48,260 --> 00:34:50,390
Right. So I'm like,

1030
00:34:50,840 --> 00:34:53,240
there are people who are so obsessed with their dogs,

1031
00:34:53,450 --> 00:34:53,720
you know,

1032
00:34:53,720 --> 00:34:54,620
I've bought them,

1033
00:34:55,280 --> 00:34:57,080
it's starting to be winter in Australia.

1034
00:34:57,080 --> 00:34:58,430
So they've got jackets.

1035
00:34:59,390 --> 00:35:01,010
Same as my kids jumpers.

1036
00:35:01,460 --> 00:35:03,350
Like, you know,

1037
00:35:03,380 --> 00:35:04,250
especially when someone's,

1038
00:35:04,640 --> 00:35:06,770
when someone gets a puppy for the first time you buying

1039
00:35:06,770 --> 00:35:07,550
a brand new bed,

1040
00:35:07,550 --> 00:35:10,700
every like three days realize that they're going to destroy them,

1041
00:35:11,290 --> 00:35:13,700
their little house for my dog recently,

1042
00:35:13,730 --> 00:35:14,750
I'm always,

1043
00:35:14,780 --> 00:35:18,260
I spend so much money on my pets and it's like,

1044
00:35:18,950 --> 00:35:20,870
we think we can win knowledge.

1045
00:35:20,900 --> 00:35:25,040
It's literally one of the least price sensitive industries out there

1046
00:35:25,340 --> 00:35:28,280
because people are obsessed with their dogs.

1047
00:35:28,820 --> 00:35:32,240
And I think it's actually a really beautiful way to educate

1048
00:35:32,240 --> 00:35:33,710
your clients of saying like,

1049
00:35:34,250 --> 00:35:34,640
you know,

1050
00:35:34,820 --> 00:35:37,650
capture these moments with your precious,

1051
00:35:37,650 --> 00:35:39,270
beautiful dogs,

1052
00:35:40,230 --> 00:35:42,240
because they're not around forever.

1053
00:35:42,840 --> 00:35:43,830
Right. You know,

1054
00:35:43,830 --> 00:35:44,640
and you just,

1055
00:35:44,670 --> 00:35:47,280
you just never know when something could happen to one of

1056
00:35:47,280 --> 00:35:47,820
your pets.

1057
00:35:47,850 --> 00:35:51,120
And I would be devastated if I didn't have beautiful photos

1058
00:35:51,120 --> 00:35:54,000
of them to remember them by one of my friends and

1059
00:35:54,000 --> 00:35:59,280
clients, she makes jewelry with people's ashes in them and things

1060
00:35:59,280 --> 00:35:59,760
like that.

1061
00:35:59,760 --> 00:36:03,750
And she started doing the same for people's pets,

1062
00:36:04,500 --> 00:36:04,740
you know,

1063
00:36:04,740 --> 00:36:07,800
because people will buy a diamond ring,

1064
00:36:07,800 --> 00:36:08,460
a pendant,

1065
00:36:09,390 --> 00:36:09,630
you know,

1066
00:36:09,630 --> 00:36:11,790
a little statue with their ashes in it,

1067
00:36:11,790 --> 00:36:12,840
for their dogs,

1068
00:36:12,840 --> 00:36:14,430
as much as they would for their humans.

1069
00:36:14,460 --> 00:36:14,700
You know?

1070
00:36:14,700 --> 00:36:15,000
And it's,

1071
00:36:15,330 --> 00:36:18,750
it's a real acknowledgement that pets are family members.

1072
00:36:19,410 --> 00:36:23,430
And so don't discount yourself that don't discount the value that

1073
00:36:23,430 --> 00:36:24,720
your clients put on,

1074
00:36:24,870 --> 00:36:26,460
on their family members.

1075
00:36:26,670 --> 00:36:27,720
Yeah. Yeah.

1076
00:36:27,750 --> 00:36:28,380
Well set,

1077
00:36:29,640 --> 00:36:30,570
you guys heard here,

1078
00:36:30,570 --> 00:36:31,440
I sweat didn't he said,

1079
00:36:31,440 --> 00:36:35,970
so go out there and charge can do it Exactly.

1080
00:36:35,970 --> 00:36:37,230
I'm yeah,

1081
00:36:37,380 --> 00:36:38,280
totally obsessed.

1082
00:36:38,520 --> 00:36:39,210
And by the way,

1083
00:36:39,210 --> 00:36:40,500
I, if you,

1084
00:36:40,720 --> 00:36:41,400
you know,

1085
00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:45,060
add photos and videos to stock photography websites,

1086
00:36:45,540 --> 00:36:46,830
I'm trying to do that at the moment.

1087
00:36:46,830 --> 00:36:50,280
I'm trying to find stock photography and it's so hard to

1088
00:36:50,280 --> 00:36:56,400
find good pictures of people with their pets and submit videos.

1089
00:36:56,430 --> 00:36:57,450
And by the way,

1090
00:36:57,690 --> 00:36:59,430
because if there are any,

1091
00:37:00,060 --> 00:37:01,950
they're all fairly the same and I'm like,

1092
00:37:02,130 --> 00:37:03,960
well, where are the,

1093
00:37:03,960 --> 00:37:07,470
like people with disabilities and their pets working.

1094
00:37:07,530 --> 00:37:08,640
And, you know,

1095
00:37:08,640 --> 00:37:11,070
I want to see the office cats and the office dogs

1096
00:37:11,070 --> 00:37:11,880
and things like that,

1097
00:37:11,880 --> 00:37:14,730
to be able to put into my videos and things,

1098
00:37:14,730 --> 00:37:16,500
because that's who my clients are.

1099
00:37:16,890 --> 00:37:17,850
Right. You know,

1100
00:37:17,850 --> 00:37:18,480
and there's just,

1101
00:37:18,600 --> 00:37:20,550
there's not that diversity there.

1102
00:37:21,240 --> 00:37:21,930
So, you know,

1103
00:37:21,930 --> 00:37:25,740
that's another opportunity as well is to showcase all the beautiful

1104
00:37:25,950 --> 00:37:27,690
diversity of pet owners.

1105
00:37:29,040 --> 00:37:30,210
Yeah. Yeah.

1106
00:37:30,270 --> 00:37:31,470
Opportunity is everywhere.

1107
00:37:31,470 --> 00:37:32,220
That's for sure.

1108
00:37:32,520 --> 00:37:33,840
Oh, absolutely.

1109
00:37:33,840 --> 00:37:34,500
And you know,

1110
00:37:34,500 --> 00:37:37,470
even thinking of all the different breeds that people get absolutely

1111
00:37:37,680 --> 00:37:38,730
obsessed over,

1112
00:37:39,390 --> 00:37:39,720
you know,

1113
00:37:39,720 --> 00:37:40,530
and it's like,

1114
00:37:41,100 --> 00:37:41,370
you know,

1115
00:37:41,370 --> 00:37:43,290
when my kids always like,

1116
00:37:43,350 --> 00:37:45,540
oh my name's not on the Willis,

1117
00:37:45,600 --> 00:37:45,780
you know,

1118
00:37:45,780 --> 00:37:46,620
the hairbrushes,

1119
00:37:46,620 --> 00:37:48,720
the personalized and things like that.

1120
00:37:48,990 --> 00:37:49,590
And I'm like,

1121
00:37:49,920 --> 00:37:53,400
yeah, but there's not always convertibles when you see things too.

1122
00:37:53,400 --> 00:37:53,700
I'm like,

1123
00:37:53,700 --> 00:37:58,020
where are the hurdles For doodles?

1124
00:37:58,020 --> 00:37:58,340
Where am I?

1125
00:37:59,520 --> 00:37:59,910
It's like,

1126
00:38:00,150 --> 00:38:01,530
it's, it's really,

1127
00:38:01,530 --> 00:38:01,770
you know,

1128
00:38:01,770 --> 00:38:03,420
celebrating every,

1129
00:38:03,600 --> 00:38:05,940
every type of client celebrating,

1130
00:38:06,570 --> 00:38:06,750
you know,

1131
00:38:06,750 --> 00:38:07,530
you really could,

1132
00:38:07,530 --> 00:38:08,280
if you wanted to,

1133
00:38:08,280 --> 00:38:10,080
you could niche down and just go,

1134
00:38:10,200 --> 00:38:12,600
I am the sausage dog photographer,

1135
00:38:13,680 --> 00:38:15,840
or I'm like the pet wedding photographer,

1136
00:38:16,710 --> 00:38:16,920
you know,

1137
00:38:16,920 --> 00:38:19,680
you can niche down because that's the beauty of the pit

1138
00:38:20,280 --> 00:38:21,900
Petro. That's funny.

1139
00:38:21,900 --> 00:38:24,900
Yeah. A lot of people do tend to not,

1140
00:38:24,900 --> 00:38:26,280
I don't think they do it consciously,

1141
00:38:26,280 --> 00:38:30,690
but they subconsciously start to become like a certain breed photographer

1142
00:38:30,960 --> 00:38:34,350
because people that are really into their breeds will have other

1143
00:38:34,350 --> 00:38:36,070
friends that are into their breeds.

1144
00:38:36,070 --> 00:38:37,180
So all of a sudden you're like,

1145
00:38:37,210 --> 00:38:39,490
oh, I've photographed a lot of doxins oh,

1146
00:38:39,700 --> 00:38:42,670
I've got like four docs on my schedule over the next

1147
00:38:42,670 --> 00:38:43,330
couple of months.

1148
00:38:43,690 --> 00:38:44,350
It's pretty funny.

1149
00:38:44,630 --> 00:38:47,500
True. And even thinking about like the,

1150
00:38:47,500 --> 00:38:48,550
the upsells,

1151
00:38:48,580 --> 00:38:48,850
you know,

1152
00:38:48,850 --> 00:38:51,850
and I I've seen this in photographers of all industries,

1153
00:38:51,850 --> 00:38:54,700
where there were over-delivers so much,

1154
00:38:54,760 --> 00:38:55,000
you know,

1155
00:38:55,000 --> 00:38:55,750
and it will be like,

1156
00:38:55,750 --> 00:38:56,260
instead of,

1157
00:38:56,740 --> 00:38:56,980
you know,

1158
00:38:56,980 --> 00:39:01,090
someone's paid for 20 photos and they'll give them 1200 edited

1159
00:39:01,090 --> 00:39:02,890
photos because they can't help themselves.

1160
00:39:03,250 --> 00:39:03,490
You know,

1161
00:39:03,490 --> 00:39:03,910
it's the,

1162
00:39:03,930 --> 00:39:06,400
it's watching those over-delivery moments.

1163
00:39:06,550 --> 00:39:07,510
But I find this with,

1164
00:39:08,860 --> 00:39:11,710
with photographers in their like entrepreneurial world.

1165
00:39:11,860 --> 00:39:16,690
Cause I get photos taken at least quarterly now just cause

1166
00:39:16,690 --> 00:39:19,330
I have a massive need for just new photos all the

1167
00:39:19,330 --> 00:39:23,740
time. But I used to not always get the upgrades because

1168
00:39:23,740 --> 00:39:26,740
they would make me look through a thousand photos and pick

1169
00:39:26,740 --> 00:39:27,550
which ones I wanted.

1170
00:39:27,880 --> 00:39:29,230
And then my photographer,

1171
00:39:29,290 --> 00:39:30,100
she says,

1172
00:39:30,100 --> 00:39:30,610
it's, you know,

1173
00:39:30,880 --> 00:39:31,930
X amount for the session,

1174
00:39:31,930 --> 00:39:33,130
you get X amount of photos.

1175
00:39:33,430 --> 00:39:34,030
And then she's like,

1176
00:39:34,060 --> 00:39:36,850
if you want all of the rest of them,

1177
00:39:37,540 --> 00:39:38,620
it's like a thousand dollars.

1178
00:39:38,980 --> 00:39:40,120
Right. And for me,

1179
00:39:40,150 --> 00:39:41,380
I've got ADHD.

1180
00:39:41,380 --> 00:39:42,430
And so instead of like,

1181
00:39:42,640 --> 00:39:45,310
go look through a thousand photos and check which ones you

1182
00:39:45,310 --> 00:39:47,170
want and pick it and you can pay,

1183
00:39:47,260 --> 00:39:47,500
you know,

1184
00:39:47,510 --> 00:39:49,090
$35 per extra photo.

1185
00:39:49,480 --> 00:39:51,250
It's an open loop for my brain.

1186
00:39:51,250 --> 00:39:51,820
That just goes,

1187
00:39:51,880 --> 00:39:52,870
oh, I can't be bothered.

1188
00:39:53,230 --> 00:39:54,580
But if she just makes it easy and goes,

1189
00:39:54,610 --> 00:39:55,450
oh, you can just have all of them.

1190
00:39:55,450 --> 00:39:56,410
You don't even have to choose.

1191
00:39:56,410 --> 00:39:56,860
I would just go.

1192
00:39:57,650 --> 00:40:00,940
Yes. And that's the same thing.

1193
00:40:00,940 --> 00:40:02,500
This a family photographer lady,

1194
00:40:02,500 --> 00:40:03,160
she was just like,

1195
00:40:03,670 --> 00:40:05,890
we can have all the rest of them for these extra

1196
00:40:05,890 --> 00:40:06,490
amount or,

1197
00:40:06,490 --> 00:40:06,820
and then,

1198
00:40:06,820 --> 00:40:07,150
you know,

1199
00:40:07,360 --> 00:40:08,590
I can do the booklet for you.

1200
00:40:08,860 --> 00:40:10,420
And it's those things that people,

1201
00:40:10,630 --> 00:40:12,340
yes, people can do it themselves.

1202
00:40:12,490 --> 00:40:13,210
Of course they can.

1203
00:40:13,210 --> 00:40:14,860
But in any industry,

1204
00:40:14,860 --> 00:40:15,550
people say to me,

1205
00:40:15,550 --> 00:40:16,870
but anyone can do this.

1206
00:40:16,870 --> 00:40:17,650
They can just do it themselves.

1207
00:40:17,890 --> 00:40:18,940
But that's not the point.

1208
00:40:18,970 --> 00:40:20,860
People want it to be easy.

1209
00:40:21,220 --> 00:40:24,040
They want it to turn up their beautiful picture of their,

1210
00:40:24,040 --> 00:40:27,460
their pets framed so they can put it on their wall

1211
00:40:27,940 --> 00:40:30,220
because otherwise it will just sit on their hard drive for,

1212
00:40:30,460 --> 00:40:31,330
for the rest of their life.

1213
00:40:31,630 --> 00:40:32,620
So, you know,

1214
00:40:32,620 --> 00:40:35,500
it's, there's so many opportunities,

1215
00:40:35,500 --> 00:40:36,640
but if you're just telling us,

1216
00:40:36,670 --> 00:40:37,930
oh, the people can afford it.

1217
00:40:38,320 --> 00:40:39,070
You know,

1218
00:40:39,070 --> 00:40:41,050
what people can afford and what people value.

1219
00:40:42,100 --> 00:40:42,340
You know,

1220
00:40:42,340 --> 00:40:42,760
you don't,

1221
00:40:42,790 --> 00:40:44,560
you can't judge based on that.

1222
00:40:44,560 --> 00:40:46,810
But also again,

1223
00:40:46,960 --> 00:40:49,720
if you're charging 80% of your clients,

1224
00:40:49,720 --> 00:40:52,780
win-win pricing that they gladly pay it then gives you that

1225
00:40:52,780 --> 00:40:54,760
20% leeway to say,

1226
00:40:54,760 --> 00:40:55,300
you know what?

1227
00:40:55,300 --> 00:40:56,440
That family really touched me.

1228
00:40:56,440 --> 00:40:57,700
And I know that they can't afford it.

1229
00:40:57,700 --> 00:40:59,320
So I'm going to give them the gallery upgrade.

1230
00:41:00,040 --> 00:41:01,780
But if you're doing that for everyone,

1231
00:41:02,170 --> 00:41:04,420
you just burnt out and resentful.

1232
00:41:04,900 --> 00:41:06,010
Right? Right.

1233
00:41:06,070 --> 00:41:07,930
Absolutely very well said.

1234
00:41:08,080 --> 00:41:11,110
I hope this has encouraged you guys to get out there

1235
00:41:11,110 --> 00:41:14,500
and try to increase your pricing and feel good about it.

1236
00:41:14,500 --> 00:41:17,170
And start to ask yourself some of the questions that you

1237
00:41:17,170 --> 00:41:19,660
need to pose to me and see what comes up for

1238
00:41:19,660 --> 00:41:21,730
you. But before we go,

1239
00:41:21,730 --> 00:41:24,970
Denise Yuca just wrote a brand new book,

1240
00:41:25,270 --> 00:41:26,350
an updated book.

1241
00:41:26,350 --> 00:41:27,910
Do you want to tell us a little bit about that?

1242
00:41:28,270 --> 00:41:31,360
Yes. So my book is called chillin prosper.

1243
00:41:31,900 --> 00:41:33,290
It's not about the dog industry.

1244
00:41:33,290 --> 00:41:36,080
I wish it's about.

1245
00:41:37,190 --> 00:41:40,340
Yes. Well finally you say that because I,

1246
00:41:40,490 --> 00:41:44,270
I also create money mindset guides for different industries and photographers

1247
00:41:44,270 --> 00:41:45,100
are next on my list.

1248
00:41:45,100 --> 00:41:48,680
So stay capitalize on that one.

1249
00:41:49,130 --> 00:41:53,330
But chillin prosper is about my business philosophy of making things

1250
00:41:53,330 --> 00:41:55,310
as easy as possible for yourself.

1251
00:41:55,580 --> 00:42:00,440
So it's finding the path of least resistance in creating your

1252
00:42:00,440 --> 00:42:02,180
business model in marketing,

1253
00:42:02,180 --> 00:42:05,810
in setting your prices and also in setting boundaries with your

1254
00:42:05,810 --> 00:42:08,750
clients. So I have a ton of scripts in there.

1255
00:42:08,750 --> 00:42:12,410
There's a lot of case studies just to give yourself permission,

1256
00:42:12,560 --> 00:42:14,000
the mindset permission,

1257
00:42:14,270 --> 00:42:16,310
to be able to chill and prosper,

1258
00:42:16,340 --> 00:42:19,700
literally to do things in a way that's fun and enjoyable

1259
00:42:19,820 --> 00:42:21,080
and profitable.

1260
00:42:21,350 --> 00:42:23,900
So I've got a ton of pre-order bonuses for people as

1261
00:42:23,900 --> 00:42:27,890
well. If you go to Denise D t.com/prosper,

1262
00:42:28,280 --> 00:42:30,260
you can see the links to buy the book all over

1263
00:42:30,260 --> 00:42:33,140
the place and you can put in your details and get

1264
00:42:33,140 --> 00:42:34,910
all those pre-order bonuses as well.

1265
00:42:35,300 --> 00:42:36,410
Awesome. So yeah,

1266
00:42:36,410 --> 00:42:38,420
you guys get out there and do that because it comes

1267
00:42:38,420 --> 00:42:41,030
out, it gets released on what July 19th.

1268
00:42:41,030 --> 00:42:43,610
So you need to order before then.

1269
00:42:44,720 --> 00:42:49,940
So right now go do it Because of your pets.

1270
00:42:49,940 --> 00:42:50,570
I love it.

1271
00:42:50,570 --> 00:42:51,650
I love it.

1272
00:42:51,950 --> 00:42:52,370
Awesome. Well,

1273
00:42:52,400 --> 00:42:54,830
Denise, thank you so much for taking the time to chat

1274
00:42:54,830 --> 00:42:55,250
with us.

1275
00:42:55,730 --> 00:42:56,510
Really appreciate it.

1276
00:42:56,510 --> 00:42:58,220
And I know my community is going to absolutely love this

1277
00:42:58,220 --> 00:43:00,530
conversation. So thank you again.

1278
00:43:02,240 --> 00:43:04,250
Thanks for listening to the hair of the dog podcast.

1279
00:43:04,280 --> 00:43:06,740
This was episode number 1 52.

1280
00:43:06,740 --> 00:43:08,450
If you want to check out the show notes for access

1281
00:43:08,450 --> 00:43:10,640
to any of the resources that we mentioned,

1282
00:43:10,640 --> 00:43:15,770
simply go to www.hairofthedogacademy.com/

1283
00:43:17,630 --> 00:43:18,590
1 5 2.

1284
00:43:18,590 --> 00:43:21,200
Thanks for listening to this episode of hair of the dog

1285
00:43:20,600 --> 00:43:23,000
podcast. If you enjoyed this show,

1286
00:43:23,090 --> 00:43:24,800
please take a minute to leave a review.

1287
00:43:25,010 --> 00:43:25,910
And while you're there,

1288
00:43:26,060 --> 00:43:27,410
don't forget to subscribe.

1289
00:43:27,470 --> 00:43:30,920
So you don't miss our upcoming episodes on last thing,

1290
00:43:31,340 --> 00:43:33,980
if you are ready to dive into more resources,

1291
00:43:34,280 --> 00:43:39,650
head over to our [email protected].

1292
00:43:39,980 --> 00:43:43,160
Thanks for being a part of this pet photography community,

1293
00:44:25,580 --> 00:44:28,040
part of this pet photography community.