Welcome to the hair of the dog podcast. Today. I have a very special guest with me. None other than Kaylee Greer from dog breath photography. You're not gonna wanna miss this one. Stay tuned.

Welcome to the hair of the dog podcast. If you're a pet photographer, ready to make more money and start living a life by your design, you've come to the right place. And now your host pet photographer, travel addicts, chocolate martini, calmness sewer, Nicole Begley.

Welcome back everybody, Nicole here, and I am so excited to share today's podcast with you. I have interviewed none other than my dear friend, Kaley Greer from dog breath photography. And if you aren't familiar with Kaylee, her work in dog breath, photography, um, you might be living under a pet photography rock in all seriousness. When you say the words, dog photography, often Kaylee's work and dog breath, photography jumps to the top of our head as who we think of now, without further ado, I'll stop talking so we can just get on with that interview. Hey, everybody, Nicole here from hair of the dog and I am here with one of my dear friends. I'm so excited to finally have her on the podcast. Haley Greer from[inaudible] as yelled over you. Cause I was so excited because I can see Nicole's little face on the, on the video too. And it's so it's so cute and adorable and lovely. And we're having the best time already before we even started recording. So got a little wild, but it's Kaylee from dog breath photography. I am so pumped to be here, Nicole. Thanks for having me. Yay. Of course. Any time I'm so excited to have you here and yeah, full disclosure. I'm supposed to be like in person in Boston this week. So I should have been able to see you in person and giving you a hug. Oh my God. Imagine this sacred hug. I just love to hug. I'm such a hugger and just my clients too. I'm typically like really like huggy and bright and hands. I shouldn't say weird. I'm always like I get out of the car and it's like, hi. And it's like a weird cold, awkward interaction. Like I was doing this thing for a while where I was going up to them and like kind of slowly meandering towards them and then like sorta doing the hug movement, like the fake them out with the arms, just to see if they were going to react and maybe hug me back. But then Sam was like, Kaylee, that's creepy. You got to stop doing the, like the hug thing where you test out people's hugs because he's like, you're making people uncomfortable. I stopped. I stopped. It's hard though. It's really hard. So I can't wait until the wheels go back onto the world and we can hug again. I know on other things. Yeah, absolutely. So, yeah. So I'm so excited to have you here. If any of you guys out there don't know Kaylee and dog breath, I don't know where you've been in the pet photography world and because she is the queen, one of the starting, uh, I don't even know what words you have thrown this whole pet photography niche into the stratosphere. So very honored to have you here

And to be

Such an important part as well, genuinely, truly. I tried to keep my head down and sort of always moving forward and not really like looking around what else is sort of going on, whether it's in the photography industry or in the dog photography industry specifically. So I don't know to hear you say those things. That means a lot to me. I don't really like ever check in with myself or like where I feel like I stand because it's, it's a recipe for weird like mental health disaster making dog photos and, and looking ahead and try to do the best that I can to try to tell the stories of these dogs in the best way that I know. How so just, just to have you say those kind of things means everything to me. Thank you. You're so welcome. Well, and I think

That's part of the reason that you've been so successful is because, you know, there's a lot of talk of, um, you know, assignments and it find your why you started with your, why, which was you love these dogs and you want to share their story and you want to create these images of the ways you see the dogs. And there is no one that I know that is more passionate about the work that they create than you. And I think that is just one of the main reasons that you've been as successful as you are.

Oh my God. Thank you so much. Keep you around for my ego. Here's the speed. But surely it's funny. My whole life, I was sort of like a little bit of a lost soul. Like I knew I was a creative person. I knew that I had a voice that I wanted to use to, to do something, to lift somebody up or to lift up something I believed in or was passionate about. But I was kind of like, flip-flopping all over the place. Typically like from, from the woman, I was a child that was very like, I'm distracted all the time. Blinking lights, shiny pennies, never have a focus, never have like an idea about like what I want to be, who I want to be. And then in college it was the same. I was like, Oh, I think I'm gonna major in this. Oh no, no, no, no. I'll double major. No, I'm going to minor in this and major in this. And Oh also, you know, I'm gonna, I want to write poetry and I want to write books. Oh. And I'll also, I want to be in a band and I want to turn my band. And like I never had. And I was really like, I was really passionate about all those different things at all times, but not, I never focused and never put all of my heart into one single thing and kind of pushed forward on that one particular thing until doc photography. And that's when I was like, this is it. Everything clicked. Everything came together. When I started to volunteer at the shelter and that's when I was like, Oh my gosh, this is the thing. Like, I'm going to put everything else that I, that I love. And I still do as you know, in my, in my spare time or whatever, but kind of like, that's all well and good, but this is what I was put here on the earth for. Like that's when I figured it out, it all became so clear when it got to the shelter. And so that's the first time I ever focused on anything. And actually I read that book that you recommended. I think you read it. I was thinking it was you, you always have these fancy books you recommend that are awesome. And it was, I think a minimalism and Oh yeah. Essentially. That's what it is essentially. Hold on. Let me see. Yeah, you got it. Yeah. Yeah. So see that scribble. There's like a black scribble of a mess on the cover. That's me the mess, the scribble mess. And then it was like, you take the scribble and you straighten out the, and you make it perfect and straight and pointed towards only one thing. And that's when everything came kind of together for me. And so that weird, crazy bananas, bonkers passion I had for all these other things, I sort of honed it and safe and it all into dog photography. And I can say once I kind of made that discovery and had that clarity, that moment of like, aha, that everything kind of changed for me. And then things started to come together pretty quickly. And I went on a wild roller coaster ride over the past. God, it's been almost 10 bull years now.

Yeah. I was going to ask, when you started photographing for the shelter, 2010

World, this is wild. Oh my gosh. I'm getting older every day. Holy macro. I looked in the mirror the other day and I was like, wrinkle. Is that a wrinkle? I can't even imagine a wrinkle.

I was so upset.

I am aging all the time, which is horrifying. Um, my knees are cracking now. Like when I go down the stairs and stuff,

I can hear all the little lines

Or whatever, but in the bowl it's awful. So, um, maybe one day I have to look into new pads for my shoots, but in the meantime, other than my knees and my one wrinkle die,

I feel really good. I feel good. I got a few wrinkles on you over here. Or the bug lands the first one's the most of the most shocking. And then you're like, Oh, well now he has friends.

Yeah. Well, you know what? Life is too beautiful to worry about wrinkles. Anyways,

Lots of stuff to do. We got all kinds of food. The dogs don't care horrified by the wrinkled I lady. So funny. So yeah. So I love this and you know, I, I kind of am the same way of just squirrel where I see so many different things, especially with my hair, the dog stops and I'm like, Oh, I want to do this. I want to do this. I want to do that. You know? And it's just, sometimes it's hard to focus and sometimes I think it almost gets a little bit scary cause you're like, well wait, but what if I should focus over here? So when you decided to go all in on dog photography, was it like, Oh, am I giving up these things over here? Or was it like totally clear, like, Oh my gosh, 100% all day.

And that's the thing. This was, that was the first time ever that it wasn't like absolutely terrifying to not necessarily give everything else up, but to say, Oh my gosh, I'm going to pick this thing and I'm going to pick this one thing. And normally it was like, Oh no, no, no, no. I got this thing over here. And I get like, you know, like twinkly lights over here and I get like pennies and I get really all over the place. And typically it was like a really heart-wrenching idea to give up. And again, when we say give up and be more like sideline or whatever, you know, cause I still like play music and I still, you know, read books like crazy. And I try to do, uh, I have like interests on the side. Although honestly, like I don't feel unfulfilled because my life is like 90% dog photography because it is the most magical thing on planet earth. Like I never found anything in my entire life that I felt was more like my soulmate than dog photography.

Yeah. I know. Don't tell Sam, don't tell him,

Unless you listen to the podcast, I love set your secrets now.

Yeah. And, but you know, it was just that, I don't know. I felt like, Oh my gosh, this is my purpose. Like everybody is here for a reason. And I feel like a lot of people spend their whole lives trying to find that reason. Um, and I, I spent a decent portion of my life, but I mean, in the grand scheme of the world, I'm still pretty young. And I feel really grateful that I did find that at like 24, it was like 23, 24. And I was like, okay. I felt at the time really bummed out because I felt like I was really old to have found my passion. You know how, like when you look at YouTube videos of like, five-year-old like little girls playing the drums,

[inaudible] proportions,

You feel like you wish you would've known even sooner. So I remember being in like my like early mid twenties and kind of finding this and going, Oh, I wish I would've found this sooner, which is a little crazy because I think in the grand scheme of life, when I like look around, I do feel grateful that I have like a decade under my belt, but I still feel like relatively, relatively like a spring chicken. Like I got, I got like time and like years in my bones left to go, you know,

Just need that little bit of, you know, something to compare it to, like, if you had found your passion at five, then by the time you get to like 23, you might be like, well, I don't know, is, is this really it? Or what about these other things I haven't explored? So I think that little bit of age, those couple of years, just give you a little bit of time to, to compare it to the other things. So then, you know, when it actually is,

I suppose it's true too. It's all about like

Things in life that are about like lining up at the right time. And, and so much of it has to do with hard work and skill, but a lot of it also has to do with just the universe and timing. And I'm sure you have, have you read Malcolm Gladwell's outliers?

I have not actually. I can't believe

It from the woman of the book wisdom who always shares all the book wisdom. You have to read this book. It is so fascinating. It's about, you know, like successes and outliers people who kind of stand out from the crowd, um, you know, names like bill Gates and, um, famous sports players and why exactly like what all lined up besides their skill and their intelligence and their talent, um, what all lined up for them for this to kind of work out in such an Epic massive way. And so on a smaller scale, I feel like a lot of things lined up like beautifully. And I feel really grateful for that. I was living in Florida for a long time before I started. And then I moved up to Boston and I got a job at Apple and I was working at Apple and I was kind of like, I loved the culture because I, uh, I felt like I could be myself. I could have my wacky colored hair that was always changing and I could be like quirky and kind of weird. And they like embraced that and accepted that. And in most professional situations, they're not really as into that, I think it's getting better these days, but, um, yeah, it was, it was like a special place to be. And so I felt good about that. But then I was, you know, basically a glorified salesperson, you know, they call you a specialist. There makes you feel fancy, but really you're just like selling and consulting with people on like what's wrong with their I-phones and fixing iPhones and you know, whatever. So in the end they felt like, Oh my gosh, I know I have this gift to give to the world. I know I have something inside me. What is it though? And what, why would I, am I squandering it because selling computers, isn't what I feel like I was put on this earth to do. And it's not what I worked really hard in college to do. It's I just, and speaking of, you know, uh, the whole really distractible can't focus on anything sort of thing. I majored in communication and visual arts, but I minored in biology so I could have that focus on animals.

Oh, nice. I didn't know that. So I could, somehow

I use my like creative. I always felt very creative and like I could, um, you know, tell a story or like I could maybe work in marketing or advertising or something and, and, but then also do it for an animal type organization that was kind of my big thing. So

I, I had this degree and I knew that I, you

Know, knew some things about the world, but like, I felt like I wasn't using it at all to its fullest potential. So that's when at Apple I started volunteering at the shelter and it was just simply because it was like long days at work. Oh my gosh. Through the Christmas season. I mean, I'm sure all of you who are listening to this have walked by an Apple store during like a holiday season. And it's like, you walked by an Apple store and like a three o'clock on a February.

Yeah. Tuesday. Yeah, exactly. Right.

It's wild. And it's like, it's really, uh, like chaotic. And unfortunately as much as like the culture there is great among like the employees and the company itself, there's a lot of negativity that gets thrown around in a retail setting just generally, right. You're dealing with the public, like in a retail setting, people are like mad. They want this. Or they want that it's people are more often angry at like the mall than they are

So

Really empathetic and really sensitive and kind of wear my heart on my sleeve. And so a lot of times, like, you know, bummer interaction at, at the Apple store, you know, after, again, like worked so hard for my degree in college and I had all these big dreams and I would like leave there and sit in my car and just cry in the parking lot, you know? Cause I know that this is not what I was meant to do. And so with that was what I started to search out. My reason, you know, that's why I started, started to sort of search out my why, which was okay, why am I here on this planet? What's the thing that from day one has been the thing that's moved me, changed me, brought me more joy than I can ever describe. And that the answer was really simple. It came to me like it smashed me in the face with like crystal clarity and that moment of, you know, sitting there crying in the parking lot and it was dogs. It's always been dogs. And so that's when I went to the shelter and I said, well, you know what, at the very least I can go be with dogs almost as a form of therapy after these horrible, long days at work where people are yelling at me about their iPhones or their iPads or whatever. And I went to the shelter and I just started to volunteer on a totally like regular basis in terms of, you know, cleaning up cages, feeding the dog. That's that wasn't, it wasn't photography at all. It was just more like me needing to find the thing that brought me clarity and joy. And maybe in those moments I could breathe and figure out what was next for. And do you have a dog at home night? Well, it's funny. I did own a dog, but I had just, uh, as the timeline goes, as I mentioned, I went to college in Florida and I lived down in Florida and then I moved up to Boston and that's where I got the job at Apple. But the reason I moved up to Boston, just because I was in a long relationship with my ex boyfriend of like nine years, he was like my longest boyfriend before Sam. And, uh, we had a dog together. We had a pit bull named Toby and he was such a special boy. So when I left, we kind of, at first we kind of did this, um, swap a rule thing like every six months.

Yeah, crazy. So

I lived in Boston, I would drive down to like Virginia and meet him halfway, like every six months or sometimes it was every like three or four months, depending on what we decided. Right. So we did this like joint custody thing with Toby, but it was, it was interesting because at the time that I was volunteering at the shelter, which is where I started to get into photography in terms of realizing that these dogs had an incredible story to tell and nobody was there to help them tell it, especially at that time, I think it's much more common now for like the shelters to have like really great photographers on their team. But, but then it was a lot of like photos through the bars of a cage, taken with a phone with the flash on with the beam. And I, you know what I mean, lighting up, uh, and the, uh, dogs looking like really fearful and uncomfortable. And so I felt like I could do at least with, you know, like whatever difference that I can make with my two small hands. That's what I wanted to do is just to try to tell these stories. And so I just brought like a point and shoot, you know, it wasn't like anything fancy, but that's where I found my answer. Like I feel like when I pause the universe for a minute to be like, what is it? Because I feel so lost. I finally like left enough silence for the answer to con come crawling through.

Yeah, no me, I rarely ever shut up. I really, I rarely ever stop for silence ever. It drops down,

It was a kidney. I can not get a freaking word in edgewise, like stop, breathe for a second, which is probably going to be a problem on this podcast. But so I, I just, uh, I, I feel really grateful and that's kind of like what that book, the outliers is about is like all these things that sort of have to line up. Like I was in Boston, therefore I ended up going to like one of the best shelter systems in the country, which is the MSP CA. And I happened to have universal shelter grounds to shoot on, to explore my creativity. Like typically, you know, as you know, from volunteering at places, we've been, you and I have volunteered in Costa Rica, like we've seen all kinds of conditions and shelters and, and typically there's not a lot of space to find beautiful surroundings. You know, it's like, you're kind of stuck in like this little play yard here, like in a city.

And, you know, there's nothing, just some sidewalks and maybe a grungy, but not in a pretty photography grungy way. Right.

Exactly. Yeah, exactly. So I just feel like that was really lucky. That was part of the formula was like, here I was in this place that had these like rolling green Hills and old Oak trees. And they even had this like graffiti, like, like railway in the back of their property that I could like try out my like funky, colorful stuff with. And so that was like a big part, I think of like how it all lined up for me. And it was a long time before I realized that, you know, maybe I should pursue this like Avenue of Oh, wow. Maybe I could. I never thought in a million years it could be a job.

I really didn't. But I thought I was going to say, how did you realize, how did you come to realize that like, Oh, wait, there's people that will pay me to do this for their dog.

Yeah. Yeah. That was, well, it was never an intention, never in a million years, like I said, did I think like, it could be like, I don't know, a profitable lose the word profitable, just a business. I just never thought it could be a business in general and then let alone like a lucrative, successful, busy business, which would come, you know, a few years later. But people would basically Scott, the power of networking communication and like social media can not be overstated. I cannot, I cannot describe to you what an and that's another thing like social media was just kind of like, I mean, it had been around already 10 years ago, but it was really getting like super popular. I mean, this was the time where like suddenly all our parents and everybody was starting to get on Facebook and starting to become involved socially for like the first time in history. Like everybody was in one place. And so that, you know, I would post the things I would do at the shelter on social media and people would start to see my work and it wasn't great by any means. It was, it was nothing. It was just like straight up, you know, point and shoot. Like, I didn't know anything about like great photography or light or anything like that yet to like make the smallest aside. I did take a couple of photography courses in college. And so I ended up, they were filmed and I had like a nice, uh, like 35 mil film camera. And those were the things that I kind of pulled from that knowledge, from the dark room and contrast and, you know, dodging and burning and all that. Like, I kind of pulled from that experience a little bit, but I still didn't know. It was only like three courses within my visual arts major because visual art was everything. So I had to do drawing and all this other stuff. And he was just like a small part of it, which by the way, I loved it and was totally obsessed with those classes. But I, at the time I just kept telling myself, well, this, this is awesome, but I can't imagine that this is a real job, you know?

Yeah. I'm so sorry. I was just going to say with your explosion of social media, like when you first started and, and cause I know you credit that to a lot of your growth was social media, but the missing kind of magical fairy dust that you always had, I think was the storytelling that you would bring to your posts because it wasn't just like, Oh, look, I photograph fluffy down by the beach. I mean, you would bring in this background in the storytelling and describe the scene and just like bring pure magic to the words, which I think then, you know, where human beings that are wired to want to tell stories and wanting to listen to stories. So you always brought the story of that dog. So I think that's the lesson for everybody. You know, we have these beautiful images to share, but we need to tell their stories, you know, however we tell our stories, we need to bring the story, right?

Yeah, no, that's a really, really good point. And, and again, I'm super humbled that you, you know, kind of like noticed the stories went along with the photos and that in some way, you know, maybe they affected you or they affected, you know, people who were viewing them and reading these stories in some way, because I it's funny because Sam is my partner, Sam, who's like 50% of dog breath. He's just the quiet half. That's what I always say. I take the photos, but he like helps run the entire business. And he's at every shoot and assisting with the dogs, assisting with toys and treats and lighting and dealing with the clients. And so he's, he's a dream, but he's also a professional photographer. And actually he really taught me everything I really know today about photography. And that's another thing, right. That had to line up. Like I met Sam right at that time. Right. When I started volunteering at the shelter and I'm like, Oh, I'm doing this thing. And I started to volunteer at the shelter and he's like, Oh wow, that's interesting. And I'm like, I'm going to, I think I'm going to take photos. And he, he was like, Oh, I have like, you know, it wasn't a great camera. I think it was like a Canon rebel or something, but he was like, I have like decently nice camera. You want to borrow it? You know, it was very interesting how it all sort of worked out, but he, in terms of like getting back to the social media and the storytelling and kind of making it work for you and for also the ability to gain attention. And for me, it wasn't the attention for like a gun. I didn't think I had a business or wanted a business or that business was the possible. It was more, I wanted, I wanted to be able to hear these stories about these dogs so we could change their lives because there's, you know, this, this little black pit bull that I know and love so deeply, that's been sitting in the back of the it's shelter cage for a year and a half. That's what drove me. That's what made me think this is important and I need to pour my whole heart and soul into it. And so that's when, you know, Sam, he would like, he was also a photographer and he would take portraits of people and his portraits are beautiful. I mean, at the time beyond anything I could ever imagine creating, he was so talented and so far beyond my skill level and I'd look at his work and I would be so fascinated and, and, and so he'd post his work and it would be amazing, but it would be, um, for example, a photo from like a wedding of a beautiful photo of a couple, like walking off into a sunset or something. And he would say like, congratulations, Caitlin. And Dan, like in the like cut caption, you know, the thing is like, people will like, certainly look at it and think lovely or whatever. And, and maybe like it and kind of move on because it's too number one, it's two strangers. They don't know the people in the photo. Number two. Um, they don't feel any connection whatsoever to the story of like Dan and Kaitlin or whatever, because they don't know who they are. They Sam didn't really give them much info. So I started to, when I shared the stories of the dogs from the shelters, it was like photo that I did my very best with that. I, I tried to go over the top to really pick a beautiful location and nice light and all this and, and, and technically expose it well and, and XYZ. But what really mattered the most was knowing the history of that dog and sharing everything I felt deserved to be shared about that dog. And, uh, those stories became quite long, which is why, again, I'm the queen of, uh, length and, and brevity is my daily struggle. And every aspect, my day is going, it takes me like literally 45 minutes to an hour to write an email. It's crazy. It's crazy. But anyway, those, but those did I, it was no, um, there's no plan in place. It wasn't, um, manufactured. It wasn't because I was trying to manipulate the results of certain photos in any particular way. It was simply just because I wanted to share these stories and that ended up turning into something that didn't become a bit of a success for me in terms of, well, suddenly there was lots of eyes on these photos because people care, like you said, we're storytelling, humans, like stories have been passed down since the beginning of time. And that's how we know about ourselves and our families and our cultures. That's, you know, I mean, take it from Disney, you know what I mean? The entire, like the entire legacy of Walt Disney is built on storytelling and fairytales and that's what makes us, it just primally resonates with us as human beings. And so, again, it wasn't a tactic. I never really thought that consciously about what I was doing. Right. But in the end, when I look back at it and I go, Oh, I do realize like why that was effective. Like, Oh, I see. Like, instead of just sharing, you know, a, a mediocre photo here and there, because let's face it at the time the photos were mediocre. I was, I was really pouring my heart into really sharing the truth about every situation and every dog and the vulnerability of doing that was I think just, there's a lot of psychology that goes into all of it that I'm really fascinated by. I'm no psychologist, but I am fascinated by it. And I read a lot of books about it. And it's, it's sort of interesting, like how to interact with crowds and how to interact with just generally, like we said, I'm like Facebook at the time, suddenly all these new people were coming on and it was people of all ages and religions and creeds. And you know what I mean, different like tags and likes and dislikes and how to bring them all together to actually care about something, how to stop them in their noisy newsfeed, where they're constantly scrolling through 800,000 pieces of stimuli a day, how do you stop them? So again, didn't know it at the time, but it was quite a successful way to go about it, I guess, in the end. Yeah.

Well, and I think it all comes down to, again, the fact that you found something that you were passionate about and you poured your whole heart and soul into it, and you know, it's just, you didn't do it. Like you said, you didn't do it for the, for the fame of it. You didn't do it for the exposure of it. You did it because you just felt this calling and this passion to do it. And which I think that is what leads to the most amazing results is when we have this, just this need to do these things. And we just, you know, do them as best we can for, for reasons, just because we want to put it out there cause we want to help the world in some way. And then the success comes,

The words, it just comes back to, I think, I think that's exactly what, what you just said. It's authenticity, it's being genuine about something and it's not necessarily like trying to build a brand or chase an end goal or an end result. Now sitting where I sit, I feel so insanely grateful that I have to pinch myself every day that I wake up and it's, it is my business. It is my income. It's, I've been able to buy my first home and travel the world and have all these amazing things as a, as a result on just kind of on the side of yeah. And, and like kind of spiritually and like everything I am is sort of built around this passion of mine, but it did start and it still is, and always will be at the core of everything. A passion that I feel really, really lucky happened to be able to also kind of translate into a job. Yeah,

It's crazy. I know. I look back at like, you know, when I started my business about 2010, about the same time as you and I look and I'm like, I had no idea where this path was going to take me never in a million years, did I think I would end up doing what I'm doing now? And I let love it every day and it just, it wasn't even on my radar. So, I mean, it sounds like you were kind of the same way. It's like dogs, photos tell a story, but like, could you ever have, imagine that, you know, fast forward now I just held up here at 47 pound books behind me. Um, this big, beautiful dog tography by Kaylee Greer book. Yeah. Do you have like, have any idea that you are going to end up in this and it's still being developed? Like we're still, we're still moving down this amazing path, right?

No, it's fine. I don't know. It's crazy. I know I genuinely cannot believe it. And like, this is getting into like some deep, like, this is some stuff Nicole helps me work through. Sometimes you guys cause like I have, I, Nicole is my therapist and I have like a deep, like, um, feeling of, uh, what's the word? Not necessarily like insignificance, but um, like I'm not worthy. And I think that a lot of artists struggle with like imposter syndrome and they're like, who am I? I'm not, you know, everybody else that you look at, I just gave a webinar the other night. And I talked about this a little bit. Cause this is something that really, really is like important to me and resonates with me to make sure that other people understand. Because when I look at my favorite photographers, when I look at people who I just idolize and feel like are absolutely like golden gods of photography and everything, they touch turns to gold and I'll never ever be able to be like them because they were born, you know, underneath the sparkling sun. And I will never be that good because I'm not made of the same DNA and I don't have the same genetics. And I'm just, you know what I mean? I look at McNally, I look at Jeremy cower at Lindsay Adler, you know, Sophie, c'mon, uh, there's so many incredible photographers that you look at and you think, man, like you see this curated like perfect portfolio and you just think, man, it all comes so easy to them. And I, I am not good enough and I'll never be good enough. And I should just put the camera down now. And it's, it's, it's tough these days with like social media is a blessing, a massive blessing and also a curse because it hurts sometimes to play that like comparison game. Like you sh it, it can kill your soul, it can kill your art. It can kill your career entirely to just be like, I don't understand, you know, why this person is so perfect and everything I do is so perfect or I don't understand why this person is so successful and look at their photos are not even great. You know, it's just like, that's why, like I said earlier in the, in the podcast, like I try to keep my head down. I actually try really not to have too many inputs of different types of like media into my head because I feel like the place where I create artistically is really, really sensitive. And like it's made of paper walls, you know, and anything can blow it down and anything can throw me off course. And as like an artist who feels so deeply, I can get thrown off for an entire week if like something kind of just blows through like on a sort of my mentality of, I'm just sort of looking forward, moving forward, trying to develop myself all the time to be better, a better storyteller for these dogs that I love so much. I don't have to be careful. Like I try not to get too distracted. And I'm kind of the reason I say all that is because I came from like a, like a pretty like low like socioeconomic background and as a child and Nicole helps me through this all the time. She said, you have these bad voices in your head and you, you're not that child anymore. You know, you've grown up. And, but I, I truly believe that I came from nothing. Therefore I am nothing. I'll always be nothing. I'm never going to be able to get through this like ceiling of like, this was placed upon me by kind of the universe or society or whatever. And I'm just the poor kid from up the street that like, doesn't have whatever it takes inside me. And I doubt myself all the time. And you know, as these things are happening, like you said, like holding up this book that I just wrote, which I just, I can't even, it blows my mind so far across the universe when I pick it up and look at it and hold it. And I can't believe I did it. And you know, getting to be, you know, on TV with Nat geo and getting to travel the world with you in Charlotte, teaching workshops and castles, it's so wild. And the little kid inside me, I think is proud, but also that little voice is always there. Like, don't you forget Kaylee, like where you came from. Like you're always going to be trash, you know? And it's terrible. It's terrible thing. But I think if I explain this to you guys here that like, know that like I'm always working, I'm always working through that to try to be brave and to kind of punch fear in the face, you know, and walk through that fear and do it anyway, because I do, I think I'll always have that little devil on my shoulder. Like you, there's only a certain place that people like you can get to in life and you're never going to get past it. So you, you know, you can try all you want, but you know, you're never going to like proceed past a certain point because that's how you were born. And, and that's a terrible, that's terrible way to think. It's terrible. And I try to check myself every day. I try to check myself often and say like, you know, you're doing great or whatever, and you're moving through it and don't worry about those nasty little voices, you know, that little, little cloud above your head or whatever. Um, and I am really proud of what I've been able to push through, but I think even, you know, for all of us, something like that, somewhere exists inside of us. I mean, unless you're a sociopath and you don't feel feelings at all, I was going to say, I think on the feeling scale, I'm more on the Sam side of feelings. Like I'm very logical and you know, and you know, every bark I ended up being in like a pile of tears at the end, but, um,

Yeah, I'm very logical and, and it is what it is. And, but I, you know, it's the same exact thing. It's the same thing of like, who am I to do this? Who am I to have this business where, you know, to, to teach other people who am I to teach workshops on the craft, like, um, I'm brains, a business brain, you know, it just, it takes a long time, you know, to, to guess get over it and tell that voice to shut up

The hell up. Yeah.

Keep on moving. So yeah, for all of you guys out there that have that voice in your head, which again is all of you, unless you're a sociopath or you're really not listening. Um, you know, you're in good company, it happens to all of us. And the trick is to just to keep going and to, to sometimes to find a friend to help you rewrite that story and look at it from a different perspective. You know, I know a lot of people get really concerned with, Oh God, no, one's going to pay this. Who am I to ask for this much for my work? And you know, it's easy to then from the outside to say, no, these people are lining up like excited to pay you. They want to pay you for your work. You're not like making them pay for anything. They're, they're really excited about it, where us, we can't see that side of it, but you need sometimes somebody else from the outside to look at it and say,

Well, that's exactly what you do for me, Nicole. It's like, I need sometimes, you know, to sit down with you and hear that because that's one of the most, that's stuck with me more than anything else you've ever said to me is how excited people are to spend money with, with me or with people who make, you know, like amazing special once in a lifetime imagery of the thing they love more than anything else on earth is their, their dog or their cat or whatever, their pets. And, and, and it's always stuck with me because I do as like the psychology of pricing as a poor kid, you know, who like right now, my, my situation in life is different and it's so weird and wild. And like, I can't believe the things that I've been able to achieve. And I still pinch myself and do this thing where I give myself no credit at all for anything I'm like, Oh no, no, no, no. It was just luck. Or it was, uh, I don't know. I don't know why they paid me that much for this. I'm not really sure, but it's just really, you know what I mean? I just, that's what I do is still chalk everything up to like, just kind of circumstance and luck or whatever. But you, you said that to me, and that really stuck with me because like I said, like growing up, you know, where like, uh, the value of a dollar was very much like reiterated over and over again, day in and day out. And, you know, we couldn't buy like fancy, you know, like new clothes or fancy, you know, anytime we live in a little tiny house and, you know, whatever for me to charge what, like my parents would spend on like, uh, like groceries in a year, like, Oh my God, this does not compute very hard for me. It's very, and I, then you tell me this and Sam tells me this, Kayla, you're not pricing for yourself. You're not pricing for people who are, you're not pricing. You're not selling it to yourself.

I have, and you can have the pro bono stuff. If you want to do something special for someone in a situation that can't, you know, can't afford what we do. Like there's still pro bono work, but yeah, you've got, you've got to get paid to write right girlfriend.

I was in like a couple, I mean, it's been a while because the world's been closed for a long time, but the Prudential center in Boston and which has this like really fancy shopping center, like a fancy mall or whatever. And I don't often spend time in places like that, but I was there for whatever reason. And I was walking by this shop. I cannot remember the designer name, but it was some really fancy clothes designer. And there were selling mostly denim and it was kind of just ugly, ugly n ormal to me, that's what it l ooked like. Right. But the store was packed and I'm like, w ow, I guess I'll just go see what all the fuss is about. So I walk in and I'm like looking around and I pick up like a pair of like, you know, like mom jeans that just l ook totally normal from the eighties. Like, I guess that's, I don't know, man. I pick them up, these aren't great. And then I look at that$1,400 and then now I service lab. I do travel the whole world and the country shooting, but mostly my clients are in Boston. I'm mostly service Boston. So to me that was like a little slice of life of this Boston area. Like, you know, MIT, Harvard, grad, like Lincoln mill kids. Like, that's what they love. They love a nice pair of$1,400, freaking eighties jeans, man, let him have it. But then the, you go to the thrift shop down the road for five bucks. But I definitely, in that moment, I kind of was like, wow, I really don't feel bad for charging, you know,$3,000 for a photo shoot.

Yes. We need to do that sometimes. Um, just look around at these different prices. I have my one credit card gives me like a$50, twice a year credit at Saks fifth Avenue, which I never ever go there, except for like, I have 50 bucks to spend for free. I should go check it out. I'm like, Oh, I can't afford anything here for$50. And I did just find out they have like food and cookies and stuff. I'm like, yes, that's what I spend that on next time. But, um, yeah. You know, sometimes you just need to look at that to be like, Whoa, Whoa, Whoa. My story of what's quote expensive is different than a lot of other people's. And likewise, there's going to be people that no matter what we charge, if we charge$25 for a shoot, someone is going to tell us that is too expensive. And you know, so would you rather work for 25 bucks or$5,000? You know, it's going to be too expensive, somebody, but it's also going to be okay for plenty of people to

Like, and like you said, like the amount of clients that I have that show up that are so thrilled about like the experience and the money they have. No, they're excited to give me a check for six grand or whatever, just on the shoot day at the location or whatever. I mean, we actually, we take payment beforehand now. So it doesn't get like awkward or weird if someone doesn't pay, but you know, you're just like, Oh, but they're thrilled. They're not upset about it. I'm not mad. I like can't wait for the experience. They can't wait for the final photos. They typically rave, you know, you hope you make every client rave about it. And I just can't, I still feel like uncomfortable discussing like that stuff with my family, except for, because they are just don't get it. They can't imagine they do that. Like you said, they can't imagine spending 50 bucks on a photo shoot, like$50. That's$50. Like he could just get a, we could use our iPhone to do it ourselves. Like that's kind of where I come

From. That's not a necessity.

God loves them. That's out of necessity. My parents had the very best that they could do for us. And I'm so grateful because they showered me with love and they made me believe that I could do anything. And so, because of that love, even if it was, you know, not the most lavish upbringing, it made me have the confidence to, to stand up and talk to that little nasty voice in my head and say like, you know what, you're wrong. I'm going smack, smack, smack. Like you told me,

Smack it down. Boy, get out of there,

Involved in all of this. That's just photograph dogs and kiss him on the face because the last things that we can kiss anyways now, since I can't kiss people,

I know I can still kiss my horse and my cat who sent me on my lap right here. But she wasn't like that children bite me.[inaudible]

Do you have one of your email signatures makes me so happy. I think it's your cat. It's Emma, right? Yup. Pat me on the butt right here and then I'll bite you or something.

Yeah. And just like person scratches. I love it. Yes. All my, um, all of my business emails that come, uh, the automated ones that come out of my business. Cause I, you know, I don't want them to pretend to be me because I want my audience or my clients to know that Oh, it was automated, but it's fun because it comes from the cat. Oh my God. I love, but it's fun. Yeah. It's my office manager. That would definitely tell me exactly. And uh, yeah, the people that don't see the humor in that. Well, you know, they're not my client. I wanted to ask you about, because you wrote a book too, sitting here, Nicole too. I know. That was never, that was never on my to-do list.

Oh, wild. It's crazy. Yeah. So what was the process of writing a book like for you?

Um, well, mine had a lot less words than yours. Not game

For surprise me, because words, words, words are my favorite

Thing. I love it. Communications major. That's all you need to know. That's built around words. No, but I just, for my brain, how I do many things, it started with a Trello board and swear, I should like be a spokesperson for Trello. And then it was just like outlines of what I need to, what I needed to write in the nice thing about it is it worked how my brain worked too, is it didn't need to be like these big chapters of a lot of writing. It was like little sections. So it was, you know, we're talking about the shoot and an exposure and working with dogs and getting attention. Like I could compartmentalize all the little things and it was like a picture and a blur picture and a blurry picture and a blurb. So it was just getting the whole flow and figuring out what I needed to talk about and watch different areas and, and writing that all out. But what if,

No, like how did you feel when you like actually held it in your hand?

Oh, it was pretty cool. It was, yeah, it was okay. Did you walk

Into like Barnes and noble and like find it, do you see it there?

I did one around the store and hold it. No, it's amazing to me though. Even more than the book, like is when I see something of mine printed really big, like something on the wall, it just, it's just my, why I'm actually in the process for my photography side of my business. I'm like taking the whole table going and rebuilding it and I'm like, Oh yeah, I'm totally redoing how, how it's structured. Like not, it's not following any rules. I am totally taking any, like all the things in like Hawaii. Do I like to do this? What do I want to do? How do I want this to look? I don't care what the best practices are. I'm going to test some different things that I think will work. And I'm pretty excited.

That's amazing. That's the kind of confidence too, that comes with time and focus and like, you know, exactly kind of who you are as an artist now. And I think over the, like at the beginning it was the same for me. Like, Oh, okay, wait, how do I do this? Um, are you supposed to price it like this? Are you supposed to make it where you're supposed to? So you like kind of look around and you get distracted and you see what other people are doing. And you're like, Oh, I guess it's supposed to be like$295 for collection that has these three things, you know, like you don't really know. So you're just doing the best you can. And I never took any workshops or anything. I didn't have any money I had, I didn't even have my own camera. I was borrowing down. Like I was so I hate to say it, but let, I don't want to say poor because that's, I mean, you are boots, but I was, yeah. I was just, you know, doing the best that I could with my little tiny bank account. And it was, you know, I wasn't doing workshops or I was just doing the best I could with like Googling stuff and researching and you know, and so that's, you kind of feel really alone in this like big giant, see like a little tiny fish in a big sea going, Whoa, if I going to am going to grow up, um, or give my term, my classy lady term. But if I'm going to grow giant balls and try to move through this like part and, and, and put myself out there and maybe fail, I guess I got to figure out like how to do it. And so that's when I started to, it was the same, just like, what does everyone else do? And I think when I stopped thinking about what does everyone else do is when like everything changed for me, I don't get what everyone else does. This is what I'm gonna to do.

And, and that works on a business level that works on a craft level. Like, you know, there's, cause I think so many people look at whether, you know, looking at someone's successful, how they structure their business or looking at what they're shooting. And they're like, well, that must be the key to success. It's not the key to success. The key to the success is that passion of I, this is why I'm doing this. And, and this is what works for me. And this was my heart and soul being put out into the world. And you can't, you can't copy that because it just doesn't work. So when you actually just start to block out the noise and say, what do I want to do? What do, what, what do I want to create negative space for me? Um, I have a, at the barcodes, some negative space, Nicole, because all the images I love, I'm like, Oh, see the negative space look negative.

Yeah. The bottom right corner. A big guy. That's my favorite. Yeah. But it's, it's when you

Start to really just look at creating things from your heart is when the magic starts to happen. And at the very beginning, we do need to look and kind of see what other people are doing just to kind of, cause we have no idea. So we maybe start collecting this different information, but the key is to collect this different information and like put it in a big masher and be like, what do I like from all of these different pieces and start picking out bits and pieces of your own. And then you get to a point where you've now learned how to do these basics and then you start creating new pieces on your own. And then all of a sudden, you know, it's all, it's all built just for you.

It doesn't well, that's exactly right. And I think like, that's the thing is you're going to be, you want to be not somebody else. You don't want to be like the second version of somebody else, the third version of somebody else you want to be the first you. And I think that was a really big part in terms of like both of our different paths that we've gone down and our different offices. And I feel really humbled by the fact that, you know, people will say, Oh, I know your work before I, before I even look at who shot it, you know, I don't look at who posted it. I just see that photo. And I go that's Kaylee's and that's so humbling to me as an artist that is like the most beautiful compliment because it's so uniquely me, it comes from my soul. It comes from that place deep down inside from that five-year-old version of me that would go screaming, flailing, running across the street and every passing dog I would see. And it was like seeing them like Kings and Queens of their dominion, seeing them like superheroes, like seeing the world as a comic book with colors and flashing lights. And it's always been that way for me. So, so seeing this very like personal vision of, of mine, especially the child and me like coming out in these images, when I started to find sort of that style, it was like, Oh, that's when I stopped giving up doing what other people were doing and looking for what I wanted to say about the world, like my own unique viewpoint. And that's when everything changed. That's when everything really blew up. I mean, I was booking sessions and I was busy before, you know, I really had a very distinct style, but as soon as I really developed who I was and my own unique voice through millions of hours of trial and error and lots of weird dreams and lots of inspiration and watching, you know, like lots of movies, I love movies and books and I'm just imagining all kinds of wild things. And it sorta came together eventually. And after that, it was like, okay, this is, this is my, this is my thing. And that's when sort of it all really fell together and dog breath became busier than I could've ever imagined. And this the same with you, with you, what you're doing with Tara, the dog, no, one's done this before in the pet, in the pet space like you are, you know what, I'm not really sure. Like if anyone's, you know, what else other people are doing and the teaching space, for example, but you're going to come up with this new sort of thing. Anyway, you're going to come up with this new webinar or this new, uh, you know, that you have or whatever, and everything you do blows away. It's so amazing to me because I'm really genuinely super inspired by you, Nicole, because I am the opposite of a business person. I am such a terrible business person and we know this right. We've had like this long storied history of Nicole trying to help me through the hard parts. Cause I feel I'm very much the other side of the brain from her. Like she's very practical. She's very logical. She's a really strong thinkers. She, I am very, you know, a kind of a dreamer and a fly by the seat of my pants and they don't really know what's happening tomorrow, but I don't want to sing about it. And I'm just going to say, it's, it's really wonderful to be able to work with you professionally and to just be your friend in general, because we really balance each other out in those lights around each other because every time

Which, you know, I got to plug our Barkus here for a second. Cause that came together, I think is a universal divine timing to where it was just like, I reached out to you and I'm like, Hey, do you want to do something? And we kind of talked about it. And then we were like, Hmm, I forget if it was you or me. I think it was you because you had done a workshop with her before.

What about bringing in Charlotte? Yeah, that sounds great.

And then the first time we actually even met each other is when we showed up in Spain. Um, Oh my gosh. Almost five years ago. It'll be five years ago in April. I can't believe it. And, and yeah, and like, we all bring something totally different to the table and it just brings us like magical little thing. And even I leave, like I go to these and I come home inspired. Like it feeds my soul going to those two and it rekindles a passion for shooting. Cause I tend to get too bogged down in like, cause I love the business side of things. So I'm like, Oh yeah, yeah. More business I can shoot later. Yeah.

Yeah. And then I'm like, why did I do like shooting? Yeah. To photograph well and oppositely for me, it's, I'm so inspired by the business side because I, I think of all these things that I can implement and that I can do. And um, in terms of like running the business because you know, I get so caught up in the art of it that I'm constantly outside at like 2:00 AM trying to photograph the stars, like, you know, my own dogs or whatever. And I'm like, wow. And I'm like not, you know, paying attention to like emailing people and like taking care of invoices and you know, whatever. And I know that like my productivity is not ideal and thank God I have Sam because my productivity, when it comes to like the making of the art is like crazy, phenomenal. It's always happening all the time. But when it comes to the actual business side and I'm like, Oh, he got like do taxes. Like I am the worst procrastinator. It's like, if it sucks my soul out of my body, like forget it. I will do everything I can to bury it in the ground and never think about it again. So Sam does our taxes and they taste, thank God for him. And he's always, you know, and this is wild. This will make you cringe so hard. Cause he'll be like, Kaylee, do you know how much we made this year? And I'll be like, and I'll like make a guest. And it's like, usually like half or like a third of what actually we did. Cause I don't really pay attention to the number. Can you just tell me when there's things are scheduled and we just show up and he's like, I can't believe you don't even know this. Let me tell you. And I just don't. I mean, I, listen, I do not recommend running a business like that. I do not recommend to everyone,

Your other half in place to run that side of your business. So it's not like you're ignoring it. Somebody else is just in charge of it. Yeah.

But I never did those sheets. You know, the sheets you're supposed to do. We were like, all right. Cost of goods. Like I got to figure out like how much I'm supposed to charge and how does my time, how much is my time worth and all that stuff, which we, we have people do often at the barcodes because it's incredibly valuable. And I literally never did one of those in my life because they horrify me. So I mean, listen, if you're like me and you're like really creative and you kind of hate the business side, there is hope for you. Just try to hire someone that can do that stuff, hire yourself or Sam. And you'll be, you'll be fine. Just make beautiful. Yeah.

Yeah. So we can create some automation and all of those beautiful things.

No, I love it. I love it. So

Now that we mentioned the markets, I'm sure there's going to be all sorts of people. Like,

You know,

Recording this. It is November what? 23rd, 2020. And this goes live December 1st, 2020. So at this point, gosh, we've done

My birthday. Oh my gosh. Okay. No, you go, you go, I have a thought, I'm putting a note in it. I'm literally writing.

And then when you guys listen to this podcast, send Kaylee a message on her Instagram and say happy birthday. And she'll be so excited.

But yeah. So,

Uh, some of you guys might know we had planned to do bark Lander. This past may, May, 2020 that obviously didn't didn't pan out. So at this point it is scheduled for May, 2021, but we're still not sure if that's going to work because we're starting a free Charlotte campaign because we don't know when people will be able to leave Australia. It's not necessarily looking like it might happen then. So anyway, it's not been in the air. It will happen. Our next two is, are that. And then we're going to go back to where it all started and do a Barcelona, the exact dates to be determined based on the whole COVID crazy situation and how this all plays out over the next couple of months. But if you guys want to be the first to know of openings, because we will be opening registration again for Scotland, when that happens, because with the change of dates, we do have a couple spaces open, just go to pet photography, retreats.com, but your little email address there. And you will be the first to know when we actually know what's happening,

What a wild weird, crazy, horrible, but amazing. Eye-opening wild thing to live through. I just like, it's so many things at once. It just blows my mind. It's so strange. And it's just, it's really, I guess it is what it is, right? Like it's science and these things can happen and it's happened and it's changed. Everything ever knew about how the world works. And it's so weird to like, um, like my dad, for example, who's, you know, in his like late seventies, like to be like, dad, have you ever lived through anything like this in your entire life? And he's like, literally never have I experienced anything like this in my lifetime. And this is it's it's really, I don't know. There are no words. I mean, it changed everything for us. We had so much travel booked were supposed to be when we, uh, taught, um, Scotland. Um, yeah. Uh, bark Lander. I was just going to ask you what the name of it[inaudible] because it guys try to think of a better name for a Scotland based Barca has to be in the name workshop. Parkland. Parkland is literally anywhere. Iceland. You got, um, you got New Zealand, lots of Ireland, lots of lands. I guess that makes sense. Right. But yeah, I don't know. It's just, we were supposed to be in Scotland for we're going to be there for like 40 days because we weren't going to go to the isle of Skye and shoot up there and get like, um, Eilis or I think they call with a sky terrier[inaudible] up there and do that. And then we were gonna, um, go down to the Cotswolds in England to go to London. We're going to go to Guernsey, possibly where Craig is from photography is from a little Island off the South coast to Guernsey. We're going to go there. And then we were going to, uh, we had all these crazy wild, cool plans. And then we were even going to potentially, this has a bit of personal life information. We're even going to look at some wedding venues in Scotland because they haven't, I've engaged for Oh God, five years anyways now. So it's not very massive priority for me to get married, but I was like, well, you know what, let's do something weird. And let's look when we're in Scotland. Let's like wedding venues. And now that's a whole thing doesn't even exist. You know what I mean? Like that whole industry like, forget it. Like I'm so glad I didn't schedule something, you know, it's all good. I don't care that much. I just want a lope with like six people on a whole bunch of dogs and someplace really just like a castle, the castle. I looked for that. So we stayed in this insane little castle in France, in the South of France for our workshop Moore. And that was amazing. It was incredible. So I was like, you know what, Sam, we're going back to that castle house and let's get married there. Let's just do a little thing with like 20 people. And so I went Nicole, they changed ownership. It was like seven times the amount of money to rent. A lot of we got in when we did, I think it's literally like$75,000 a week now, which is insane. I was like, we'd have to charge so much. There's no way it was the most amazing house. It was owned by the King of France. There was like an 11th century, like, um, church in the middle of it. Right? Like in the middle of the house, it was so wild. So I thought that would be cool. But yeah, apparently somebody took it over and forget it. We lost every opportunity to ever. Right. There's so many, there's so many amazing houses. Life is short, but we'll keep on going. Yeah, no, I, I think it's important. You know, even though part of part of this year has sucked like the getting, having to cancel bark, Lander and Barcelona and um, like personal trip to Italy. It was supposed to be my year of three trips a year out now it's zero. But, um, you know, there there's been good. That's come out of it too. You know, it's given us space to do more things, to appreciate different things to, to, I think all of us the biggest is to look at our life and be like, is this, am I doing what I really meant to be doing? Like, it's been a great pause for people to really look at, you know, take stock of what they're doing and how they're spending their time and make better decisions that they like, you know, for them not because it's what the, uh, you know, society tells them that they shouldn't be doing or what their parents told them. They should be doing growing up that they can follow, but their path. Well, I think it's so easy to, for people to get super caught up in the daily grind and the daily routine of kind of, for lack of a better term, like the kind of the daily rat race of like you get up, you go, you get in traffic and get to the work. You do the thing you come home and you're really tired. You don't really want to, you know, like soul search too much. Cause you just want to watch Netflix on the couch and eat dinner and go to bed and do it all again. And then the weekends are like this coveted time of like, okay, I have two days to be a human. So let me like, you know, go hiking or take my dog somewhere or whatever. So people don't really ever take the time to let it turn inward and look inside. Right. Am I fulfilling? Are you, you don't have time to be Kaylee at Apple that one day sitting in the car crying and going, am I fulfilling everything I was meant to do here on earth? And I think it's been a really massive eye-opener for a lot of people and it's okay if you know, some people might take stock, like you said, of what they've got going on and they might go, you know what? I love it. And I'm thrilled and there's no problem with that. But other people might realize that there's something in their heart that's been missing for a long time. And now this silence and this relative solitude and quiet has allowed that to come to the surface. And so it's a good time. I think it's a real, um, it's, it's a double-edged sword because it is in a way, a real blessing for a lot of people to have that breathing room. But it's not great that, you know, people are sick and also dying. That's a massive bummer. It would have been nice if it came with something a bit different. But, um, yeah, I, yeah, for us, for Sam and I, the awesome thing was that we have a waitlist of private clients that has been like ever expanding for years. It's kind of like something that definitely is a kind of a constant positive, but still like a constant anxiety on my shoulders. Like, Oh my God, am I, God, am I got it? Like I see all these names coming through and I'm like, how can I ever get to all of these? I'm never going to be like home long enough and I'm never going to be able to, Oh no, here it comes to Nicole. We'll raise your prices. That'll cut some of them up like twice now. Like I've kind of cleaned. I don't want to say cleaned out the list, but it kind of like ended out a couple times because of price like hikes. And it's still got to the point where, um, we had almost like 200 names on it at the beginning of this year. And we were like, Oh my, and that gives me like proper panic attack. Cause I'm like, how can I ever do that many this summer? Since we were like grounded here, as soon as the world like reopened and we were allowed to like go back outside and go to parks and stuff we started. And that would have been like the first week of June, I think, or maybe the very last week of may or something here in Boston. And we shot so much this summer, locally, we had the most amazing summer. We were so busy with private clients and everybody was like, wonderful. And it was just such a beautiful experience. And so we finally able to get through like, not nearly the whole thing, but like a good chunk of the waiting list for the first time ever. So that was, that was a weird side. Blessing was like, well, you know what, we're grounded. Like let's make the most of it. And we got nothing else going on. So let's just shoot. And it made me kind of focus on the beauty of where I live again, because it was like, I'm often looking for these grand Epic places that are like some crazy plane right away in a mountain hike and don't get me wrong. I love that. But it made me kind of largely ignore my local area for many years. So I got to really like rediscover the beauty here and like really find, and we scouted all these amazing new parks and places in Rhode Island and in New Hampshire and, um, rivers and lakes and oceans. And it was an awesome summer. So we had a really weirdly a very like busy and also like great successful year for the business. But it's funny too, because we didn't physically get to shoot from February until may like world was shut down. So we were trying to get approved for the mortgage on this house that we just bought our first home ever. And the mortgage officer was like, well, tell me how much money did you make from January?[inaudible] the answers that you need to make up your entire year's income in the next few months for us to be able to like consider this. And we were able to do it with our private shoots, like make up the whole entire year. So, wow. I love it. That's one of those things. It's like when you ask me if I ever thought when I was like a kid realizing that I was not going to amount to much or thinking maybe I wouldn't, uh, would, would this all work out for me? And could I kind of believe where I stand? And the answer is I genuinely cannot. I genuinely cannot. And speaking of all that, my book comes out tomorrow, actual tomorrow or tomorrow when this is released tomorrow. So I know it will be out. So here's the thing. People ordered the book, uh, dog tography, uh, knock your socks off guide to capturing the best dog photos on earth. It is. I can't believe I wrote on, I cannot believe just to call back to something uncomfortable for everyone. It's huge. My higher quarantine. So those months that, you know, the mortgage guy was like, what were you doing? Making no money. I was like, okay, it was writing a book. So for real, so January to may, I was just cost 10 hour days in front of the computer, like blue light migraines. Every time it was like, it was a lot. And it was definitely something that I felt was absolutely impossible. This is an impossible task. I will try it, but likely I will find that the impossible task remains empty. It's not because it's in my hands. I can't believe it. It sits here in my hands. It was a weird law, wild like process. It was a lot of, um, a lot of like back and forth and copy editing. And then layout was like a whole huge debacle because like laying out the book with all my photos and originally they were all really small in the pages. I was like, no, no, no, you must not know me. We need to do in your face full page, full color. Then the CMY K conversions sucks.

Okay.

And all these photos and RGB like color profile, right? Like everyone does beautiful, amazing, vibrant, spectacular colors. And then they're like, okay, well just make sure you convert everything to C, M Y K, which is great.

Excuse me. No, that's how they print. Oh, by the way, printers only use four colors of ink to make all the colors in the rainbow.

I have to do cyan, magenta, yellow, black. And that means that's all they use to make every color in a picture, which takes your photo file and you go, Oh, so nice. And then you change it and you go CNYK convert. And then it goes a giant poop.

It's like dull and like matted and like dark and, Oh, it was really hard for me.

So that was a massive process. Massive. It was so stressful and just like uncomfortable to go through with all that. And then, um, and then, uh, writing like the acknowledgements and all those things that you don't think that hard about when you read someone else's book was the hardest part. Cause you're like, I don't know, like thank all the people I love and the people who made a difference in my life and who lifted me up to the stars and support me. And so it was crazy and now it's real and now it comes out.

So I'm going to go to Barnes and noble and I'm going to run around

Screaming with it, above my head. I'm going to hold it above my head. I love it. The entire store all day, every single day.

What's your mascot. Don't worry

To fly mask. I'll have double mask.

I love it. So where can people go find the book? Because every single dog photographer out there want to be dog photographer or just, if you love dogs, go get the hits. Thank you, Nicole. It's wild.

So let me tell you something really quick. Okay. When I first turned in the manuscript, they were like, Kaylee, this book is going to be 600

Pages long. They're like, you need your, I need all the pictures on their own page.

We need to take out at least like two or three chapters. And I was gutted, devastated, disgusted. It felt awful about everything. But in the end we ended up taking out two chapters, which were kind of a little fluffy and extraneous. And it ended up with, uh, I think 14 chapters. And it is, I made like to say that it covers everything you could ever even remotely consider about the subject of dog photography. I think it's literally everything I think I tried. But anyway, let me tell you where you can find it. Now, circling back to that originally you can get it on amazon.com. Pretty easy to search dog. Tography let me ask you guys a massive favor. This is huge. Apparently it's really a big deal for the book to get reviews. I guess that's a really big deal on Amazon, like for their algorithm or something. So if you love it, if you read it and you love it, would you leave me a review? That would mean so much to me. If you don't want to give it anything other than five stars, don't worry about leaving.

I'm not asking you to give me five stars, but I'm not not asking you to go. No,

Well guys, I'm kidding. I'm not going to twist your arm, but it would really be amazing. I mean, so much to me because of the publisher kept like hammering that home to me in all of our meetings, like make sure you get reviews. Um, the other thing is, uh, Rocky nook is my publisher. You can order the book directly through Rocky nook and I'm not sure if this promo code is going to be active at the time of this podcast release, but just in case guys, try it just in case, try the promo code dog. Tography 40. If you order it through Rocky nut.com, because right now they're running a little, like deal of the week on it because it's like a new release. So it might still be there. So you might as well try that. And for whatever reason, if it doesn't work and you feel more comfortable going with Amazon, whatever, either way you can go Rocky nook.com or Amazon and just search dog tography or just search my name or maybe even your local bookstore or anywhere, anywhere books are sold. So if you have like a little guy in your town, they'll order it for you to be there, but they can order it for you. Or you can do it. I don't know what other people have books a million. I don't know. Give me some off-brand bookstores borders. I don't know. I don't think borders is still open anymore. I think they closed this Barnes and noble guys. I love going to bookstore, just like walking around town anyway. They'd love it. They can't wait for you guys to see it. I genuinely can't like I'm so I'm so bowled over. It's so weird. It's a weird, it's a weird life. It's beautiful. It's a beautiful day. Well, where else can everyone find you Kaylee to follow your daily adventures? Follow me on the old grams. Try to find me on Instagram is, and I'll tell you why, because I keep that really updated. I I've been kind of bad, bad, bad dog when it comes to my Facebook, because I've been a little bit separated from Facebook for the past, like COVID year, just because it's been kind of nasty, you know, like the politics and Oh boy, everybody's opinions all the time. It's like, it's not great for my like mental state. Like I said to you, it's like a little paper room where I create my magic and I can't let, I can't let bad stuff in. So, um, Facebook has been kind of gnarly, but I do update my Facebook. So just in case it's facebook.com/dog breath photo, I forget. Yeah, dog breath, photo, just Google it, whatever. And then this is so professional. Isn't it? And then Instagram though is really where I keep updated and I try to do stories every day and show you what I'm doing. And I'd take you behind the scenes on all my shoots, even if I'm just like sitting at home editing, I'll try to show like, you know, a little edit or something on my stories. Instagram is at dog breath photography, and then just go to my website to peruse www.dog breath, photo.com. Awesome. Hailey, thank you so much for taking the time to chat with us. I'm sure everyone has really enjoyed hearing from you and, and just learning about how your magic came to be. Yeah. Just reminder, you guys all have magic inside you too. So just figure out what it is you love and pour your heart and soul into it. And pretty soon more magical proper Walt Disney. I love it so much. Thanks so much everybody. We'll see you next week.

Thanks for listening to this episode of hair of the dog podcast. If you enjoyed this show, please take a minute to leave a review. And while you're there, don't forget to subscribe. So you don't miss our upcoming episodes. One last thing, if you are ready to dive into more resources, head over to our [email protected]. Thanks for being a part of this pet photography community.